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[News] BoXer on the assembly lines?ANN.lu
Posted on 01-Feb-2000 09:00 GMT by Christian Kemp22 comments
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Here's one more thing I read on Slashdot: An "Anonymous Coward" writes in this article: the new Amiga BoXeR motherboard with redesigned AA+ chipset-on-one-chip [..] is finally actually on the assembly lines now. Take this with your usual grain of salt, ie. it's an unconfirmed anonymous rumour.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 1 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Matthew O'Neill on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
I want it to be released, but I seriously doubt it ever will :/ ad itll be too late if it is ever made. Is there a site with info on what it will have on it? prices etc...
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 2 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
The BoXer can be interesting but without 68k, a good PPC (G3 minimum) and a 3D gfx board. The AA+ is very interesting point for compatibility and mobile reasons (you can bring your BoXer and plug in on a TV)
I personaly don't see the interest to have a 668k in a "new" Amiga.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 3 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
The BoXer can be interesting but without 68k, a good PPC (G3 minimum) and a 3D gfx board. The AA+ is very interesting point for compatibility and mobile reasons (you can bring your BoXer and plug in on a TV)
I personaly don't see the interest to have a 68k in a "new" Amiga.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 4 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Christian Kemp on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 3 (Ben Yoris):
> The BoXer can be interesting but without 68k, a good PPC (G3 minimum) and a
> 3D gfx board. The AA+ is very interesting point for compatibility and mobile
> reasons (you can bring your BoXer and plug in on a TV)
A BoXer I might buy wouldn't necessarily need to have a PPC, but instead I'd
really like it to have SCSI, EIDE, a nice gfx card and an ethernet adapter.
Not neccessarily built-in, but if these four options aren't available, I will
certainly not buy a BoXer.
> I personaly don't see the interest to have a 68k in a "new" Amiga.
I only see an interest for a G3 or G4 if it makes the BoXer cheaper and/or
faster than a 060 model. As long as a PPC just sits there to emulate another
CPU or act as a rarely-used coprocessor, I don't want it.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 5 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Ralph on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
The prices that floated around make the BoXer look very unattractive to me. 2-3 thousand
German Marks for an 68k Machine (PPCextra pay) is a pretty expensive beastie to me.
If it is not possible to produce the machine for less money there will be nearly no market at
all (IMHO). Maybe they redesigned it and were able to lower the price significantly (!), then
they could find their niche in replacing BigBox-Amigas in existing environments - but then
again Z3 compatibility will be an issue (which is not cheap, either).
All in all the same prodcure as every year: Wait if something eventually comes true (but don't hope
for it!) and judge it, when it is actually buyable.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 6 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Ralph on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 5 (Ralph):
... should read: "... IF it is actually buyable SOME TIME"
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 7 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by the man in the shadows on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Ralph):
Well, I would buy like two or possibly three boxer system boards... but the problem is I don't want anything with them, just the board, and since I'm no dealer, they won't even give me prices to that effect. Sigh, it would have been nice to have a BoXeR system. Oh well.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 8 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Johan Rönnblom on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
That's probably because unlike some dealers, Access innovation
themselves don't sell things which do not exist. Maybe if/when they
actually get to production, they will offer you a price. I hope so.
Btw: Don't believe any statement that the boxer is out unless
Access/Mick Tinker says so.. :)
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 9 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Paul Laycock on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
I'd love to get a BoXeR. Though it looks as if it's going to be a bit more than your bog-standard 1200, it does have the added advantage of having a faster AGA chipset, plus more expandibility without using dodgy hacks or fixes.
I'll probably wait for a suitably high-spec PCI graphics card to be supported before I get one though.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 10 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Marcin Juszkiewicz on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
I think that BoXeR is too late. This machine should be available 3-4 years ago. Today is tooo overpriced (I can buy A4000 + GFX + SCSI + 040/40 for the price of BoXeR's motherboard).
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 11 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Phil on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
X68k with 10 Mhz. it's a joke today..
We need RioRed G4 Motherboard or similar....maybe a Apple Sawtooth board like
witch is running Amiga OS native or with emulation and a modern ppc microkernel
underthere. The BoXer features are good for now to eventually compete with
comming up Milan II Atari clone, but its not a breathtaking solution for
the years to come.
We need AGP,MPX Memory Bus with SSRAM/DirectDRAM support,PCI,USB,Firewire and
so on... and AmigaOS must able to support all that standards.
Than we have a future for sure.
But the time is now critical. Developers and dealers are taking care about
all the anouncements from Phase5,Metabox,Amino and so on, but they can't not
really live from them. We need new breathtaking products, especially on
Hardware section.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 12 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Mark Olsen on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 4 (Christian Kemp):
> I only see an interest for a G3 or G4 if it makes the BoXer cheaper and/or
> faster than a 060 model. As long as a PPC just sits there to emulate another
> CPU or act as a rarely-used coprocessor, I don't want it.
Have you ever tried browsing with ppc datatypes ?
Or playing mpeg layer 3 with free cpu time ?
Or doing rc5 with more than 50kkeys/sec ?
Or played Quake in a reasonable speed ?
Or played WipeOut ?
Or seen an vcd ?
Or encoded layer3 ?
Or alot of other stuff ?
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 13 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Christian Kemp on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (Mark Olsen):
> Have you ever tried browsing with ppc datatypes ?
I'm browsing with MSIE 5.0 on a fast PC. :)
> Or playing mpeg layer 3 with free cpu time ?
Doing that on the PC.
> Or doing rc5 with more than 50kkeys/sec ?
idem.
> Or played Quake in a reasonable speed ?
> Or played WipeOut ?
I'm not playing any games on any computer. :)
> Or seen an vcd ?
Nope, don't own VCD's. :)
> Or encoded layer3 ?
No need for it.
> Or alot of other stuff ?
This is pretty much my point: Apart from raytracing, MP3 de/encoding and games, there is no real need for a PPC. I was primarily using my Amiga for writing mails, editing Perl source code, copying CD's and some quick scans. Nothing spectacular. As such, a 060 Amiga would suit my needs perfectly.
To me, CPU power is not the most important thing. More important is the possibility to use a multitude of peripherials, to connect to other machines on a network, to have a decent screen resolution...
Anyway, off to bed I go. :)
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 14 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Mark Olsen on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 13 (Christian Kemp):
>I'm browsing with MSIE 5.0 on a fast PC. :)
Besides MSIE has severe flaws and security bugs, it is a royal pain in the a*** to use.
And why play mpeg layer3 and stuff on a PC when it is possible with Amiga ? Sorry to say, but either you really like Windows, or you have dirt between your ears.
Oh, wait. That might sound like i really want to offend you, but that's not the case.
I just hate the "Oh, why buy a PPC to do xxx when i can do it with my PC ?"
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 15 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Tomás J. Cantó on 31-Jan-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to the post 7.
It is said that BlitterBox will sell motherboards of BoXer after selling some (?) "complete computers".
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 16 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Scott Pistorino on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT
I don't care if you all say it's to little to late, I'm getting one!!! My A4000
is getting to old for me to depend on it. I love the Boxer just for the reason
it's NEW and IMPROVED!! Let's be reasonable. How BAD could it be? How bad could
PCI slots, a 040/060/PPC ready board, AGA emulated chipset and more really be?
I think once it's out it will find it's niche and sell. Remember no one's going
to MAKE you buy if you don't want.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 17 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (the man in the shadows):
> Well, I would buy like two or possibly three boxer system boards... but the
> problem is I don't want anything with them, just the board, and since I'm no
> dealer, they won't even give me prices to that effect. Sigh, it would have
Unfortunately because some idiot setup the distribution deal, the ONLY place allowed to sell boards only in Nroth America is AntiGravity.. and AntiGravity is the distributor for North America and they are insisting that any dealer they sell to must sell it as a complete system.
So not only are you going to get an interesting motherboard with mid-90's advancements tied to mid-80's technology, but you are going to get pricing from the 70's.
It would be smart to sell just the board. That way the customer can stick it into whatever ATX case they want, with whatever hard-drive they want, with however much RAM they want. A canned machine from a 'dealer' is not always going to be the best thing since you then have to deal with only what they sell.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 18 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Mark Olsen):
> Besides MSIE has severe flaws and security bugs, it is a royal pain in the
> a*** to use.
No offence or anything, but you'd have to be a real idiot to not understand IE5.
As for security bugs, at least they get fixed and updated.
> And why play mpeg layer3 and stuff on a PC when it is possible with Amiga ?
> Sorry to say, but either you really like Windows, or you have dirt between
> your ears.
Why? They sound better on a PC, easier to manipulate and encode on a PC, have better players, and you can get away with a P100 to play them on. Sheesh, try doing that on your 030 Amiga.. :)
> I just hate the "Oh, why buy a PPC to do xxx when i can do it with my PC ?"
Because PC's are cheap, available and usually work.
Amiga's and PPC cards cannot meet any of those standards right now.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 19 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT
Concerning the fact that the BoXer is late :
if the BoXer is not out in the few months to come, then I'll think it will be a good idea to prefer a POP mother board that H&P is likely to launch end summer.
And maybe Mick Tinker is working on this project also. Imagine a POP mother board with a daughter board on which there's the AA+ for super compatibility ?
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 20 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Teemu I. Yliselä on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT

You know, thinking of BoXeR, it would've been a real killer machine 5 years ago. It could've fought up there with the big ones. If something like BoXeR would've been released back then, we may not be in the mess we are now at all.


But now, it's simply too late. I mean, nobody even makes PCI graphics cards any more...

BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 21 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Mark Olsen on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Anonymous):
> No offence or anything, but you'd have to be a real idiot to not understand IE5.
> As for security bugs, at least they get fixed and updated.
User: Typing into the url box of IE5: 192.168.0.55 (This is with the ethernet board configured for ip: 192.168.0.42 subnet mask: 255.255.255.0)
IE5: IE5 is now going to call the internet. If you do not press cancel within 30 seconds, i will.
User: Pressing cancel, of course.
IE5: Navigation cancelled.
User: #¤"¤"¤%/"&/##
And for the securitybugs at least getting fixed: THEY SHOULDN'T BE THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE!
Do you ever see Aweb or Netscrape or IBrowse with a minor security glitch enabling a website to delete your HD ?
Or How about the mailer ? Whooops. I just send 50 emails because you clicked on me.
And certain localizations of it will translate Re: and Fw: into (Danish example) Sv: and Vs: IT STINKS, AND CAN'T BE CONFIGURED AWAY!
And usually IE5 infest the whole system, making it unstable etc.
And then it is simply not userfriendly.
It has the menu items under the wrong menus.
> Why? They sound better on a PC,
Compared to paula, maybe. Stick an 8-bit soundcard in your pc and try again.
Or a 16-bit soundcard in your Amiga.
> easier to manipulate and encode on a PC, have better players,
Easier to manipulate layer3's ? How ?
And easier to encode ? God dammit, there is programs (For amiga, of course) fetching the cd info from cddb, and encodes with one f*** push on a button.
> and you can get away with a P100 to play them on.
> Sheesh, try doing that on your 030 Amiga.. :)
There is a little difference between a P100 and an 030 amiga. Now, try again with a 100 mhz 603 and the pentium. Or a 386 and your 030 amiga.
> Because PC's are cheap, available and usually work.
> Amiga's and PPC cards cannot meet any of those standards right now.
PC's are cheap. And a bunch of crap. And most Amiga's do work. Unless they have been tortured.
Lets do some summing:
Amiga 1200 - £100 new, £40 used
Tower - £150 new, £50 used
CPU Board (ppc+040) - £200 new, £100 used
BVision - £200 new, £100 used
HD - £90 new, You don't wan't a used.
CDRom drive - £30 new, Ditto.
64 mb ram - £50 new, You can't get it used :)
thats £820 for a new system. Then you might want to add a 16-bit soundcard and a monitor.
If you can afford a PC, then you can afford this too.
---
Now, pc lamers. Go home.
And for you who really need a PC but don't want a PPC, you are SOOOO lame.
"I need a PC because my 030@28 mhz amiga won't let me decode a 800x600 jpeg in a few seconds"
"I need a PC because my 030@28 mhz can't show mpegs."
"I need a PC..."
Think over it.
BoXer on the assembly lines? : Comment 22 of 22ANN.lu
Posted by Bill Toner on 01-Feb-2000 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Anonymous):
>> Besides MSIE has severe flaws and security bugs, it is a royal pain in the
>> a*** to use.
>
>No offence or anything, but you'd have to be a real idiot to not understand IE5.
>As for security bugs, at least they get fixed and updated.
At least my Amiga is naturally immune to the viruses and things that come along before
those security bug fixes are available.
> And why play mpeg layer3 and stuff on a PC when it is possible with Amiga ?
> Sorry to say, but either you really like Windows, or you have dirt between
> your ears.
>
>Why? They sound better on a PC, easier to manipulate and encode on a PC, have better players, and you can get away with a P100 to play
>them on. Sheesh, try doing that on your 030 Amiga.. :)
For me to encode, I select the song from the CD and press "encode". What could possibly be easier than
this on a PC?? And I've played MP3s with my K6-2/300 through the same speakers as my Amiga's
Delfina Plus sound card, and the PC really didn't sound any better. And I have a Soundblaster AWE 64...
Not even Paula 14bit mode in AHI was noticably worse than the SB64... And you can get away with a
P100 to play them on?? Whoopty-crap. I play them on an 060/66 and can still browse the web...
And better players? I'll assume this refers to WinAMP as it's the only one I've seen PC users running.
Amiga has a player just like it...
> I just hate the "Oh, why buy a PPC to do xxx when i can do it with my PC ?"
>
>Because PC's are cheap, available and usually work.
My PC is currently braindead, it somehow lobotomized itself. Turned it on one day to be greeted by a "cannot find explorer.exe, you
must reinstall windows" message. I'll never understand why these pieces of dog crap
computers took over the world...
>Amiga's and PPC cards cannot meet any of those standards right now.
It might not be as cheap as a PC, but it's a hell of a lot more pleasant to use. The
problems my PC makes me fight with are literally bad for my blood pressure as they make me
so furious. I'd rather pay more for something that won't literally cause me heart disease...
(yes, it does actually make me so furious sometimes that my blood pressure goes way up,
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