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[News] Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversyANN.lu
Posted on 17-Oct-2000 19:42 GMT by Christian Kemp67 comments
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Elbox isued a press release on the subject of the Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy. Please read more below.
INSIDER REPORT
ELBOX COMPUTER
http://www.elbox.com
Krakow, 17 Oct 2000

In brief

In July 2000, ELBOX Computer and Frank Mariak (VFD) negotiated and
agreed upon writing drivers for MEDIATOR PCI busboard.

Frank Mariak agreed to write the software with hardware and technical
documentation provided to him by ELBOX Computer as requested by him.
He had never asked for cash reimbursement and never asked for making
cash-based contract.

Frank Mariak was to write drivers dedicated for ELBOX hardware,
to the order of ELBOX, based on an agreement between ELBOX
and himself.

Frank Mariak's long-term benefit was spreading and popularising
his commercial product: CGX4.

Ultimately, Frank Mariak sold rights to these drivers in exclusive
form to a third party, who are not affiliated with ELBOX Computer
in any way. This transaction, with the following use of confidential
ELBOX documentation within third-party agreements is clear-cut
breach of commercial law in any country in the world.

This step was thought to block developing highly-demanded software
for Amiga computers.

ELBOX Computer decided to clear this situation up in the following
report.

The last part of the report announces software solutions to make
good the damage caused by Frank Mariak's decisions.

Read more…

On Saturday, 14 Oct 2000

community of Amiga users were informed that an agreement was signed
by virtue of which Mr. Frank Mariak (Vision Factory Development)
transferred exclusive rights to Voodoo PCI drivers written by
himself to a third party.

We, ELBOX Computer, feel obliged to make the entire situation clear
to Amiga users world-wide, as the circumstances around this event
are twisted again and again and give false image of the situation
to public opinion.

Please find the below report as the clarification of what has been
transpiring in the recent weeks behind the scenes.


Background

On 24 July 2000, Elbox Computer and Vision Factory Development
jointly released an announcement on concluding an agreement,
by virtue of which VFD undertook to develop support for PCI graphic
cards installed in the MEDIATOR PCI busboard.
(See http://www.vgr.com/mediator/pressrelease1.txt )

Before this agreement was concluded, both parties negotiated
and finally decided on some specific terms and conditions of
co-operation as follows:

The key point of the agreement was that support for PCI graphic
cards in CGX3 was to be devoid of hardware acceleration, which
was to be fully developed in the CGX4 commercial version.

The parties decided to make the following commitments:

1. ELBOX Computer shall make the developer's documentation for
the MEDIATOR PCI busboard available in order to complete the
agreed work.

The developer's documentation was transferred to
Mr. Frank Mariak on 14 July 2000.

2. ELBOX Computer will provide Vision Factor Development with
computer hardware for preparing drivers for PCI graphic cards
installed in the MEDIATOR PCI 1200 busboard, which Mr. Mariak
needed at that time.

ELBOX Computer sent the hardware: Amiga 1200 in E/BOX tower
with the developer's MEDIATOR PCI 1200 busboard, 1240 turbo
card, FastATA 1200 controller, a hard disk and other necessary
add-ons as well as S3 ViRGE and Voodoo3 PCI cards to
Mr. Frank Mariak on 07 Aug 2000. Another computer hardware
set was delivered to VFD team last week.

3. Vision Factory Development shall develop support for graphic
cards operating in the MEDIATOR PCI busboard. Support for
S3 ViRGE and Voodoo3 chipsets was agreed upon as the minimum.

S3 Virge:
ELBOX Computer received a test version of an S3 ViRGE card
driver (enabling starting Workbench in the S3 ViRGE PCI card)
from Vision Factory Development on 18 July 2000;
S3 ViRGE drivers are currently available.

Voodoo3:
ELBOX Computer received a test version of Voodoo3 drivers
for MEDIATOR PCI for presentation purposes (allowing for
operation with Workbench) on 29 Sep 2000.

4. ELBOX Computer, after starting the production of the MEDIATOR PCI
busboard shall deliver a bundled free package of CyberGraphX v.3
along with drivers for all the currently supported PCI graphic
cards.

ELBOX Computer is now selling the MEDIATOR PCI busboard
through the network of its distributors world-wide.
CGX3 is bundled with MEDIATOR PCI. This is an excellent
advertising move for the commercial CGX4.


Before the agreement

ELBOX offered Mr. Frank Mariak that our programmers would prepare
drivers for various graphic chipsets, including Voodoo3 PCI, for
working with CyberGraphX. Such drivers would then be transferred in
the form of source codes written in assembler for Mr. Frank Mariak's
authorisation and distribution. We expected only making available
some developer's information related to CGX in return.

However, Mr. Mariak decided he would himself write the drivers
if we supported him with hardware and documentation. Which we did.


False information

in the announcement on selling rights to Voodoo drivers included
alleged expected technical problems related to implementation
of 3D drivers with our MEDIATOR PCI busboard.

Please note that none such problems exist. On our request,
Mr. Mariak was to report to us any possible problems related
to his development work… and he remained silent all the time.


Using Developer's Documentation

for MEDIATOR PCI and computer hardware (including Voodoo3 PCI card)
provided free of charge by ELBOX Computer as requested by Mr. Frank
Mariak for writing Voodoo3 drivers, as it turned out, for another
company is the clearest form of breaching rules of social life
and business honesty and integrity.


New business vision

On 13 Oct 2000, Mr. Frank Mariak signed an agreement on selling
the Voodoo3 drivers for benefit of another company. In contacts
with our company, Mr. Frank Mariak never mentioned any intention
of this kind on his part, never suggested such a possibility
and never asked for or negotiated any payment for his software
writing work. He never contacted us in this issue.

Then, out of the blue, he surprised us and all Amiga users with
making a "simple BUSINESS DECISION" (original quotation from
Mr. Mariak's response to our inquiry for explanation of the
VFD & DCE's announcement) on making an alliance with a third
party for selling the above rights.


We hope this explanation clarifies the situation.

Please make sure that we refrain from any comments of ethical
or whatever nature. The above are simple facts to make you all
aware of the plot behind the scenes.


ELBOX MOVES FORWARD

In the view of the circumstances described above, ELBOX Computer
hereby announces that our programmers shall prepare software
for supporting Voodoo3 cards in the MEDIATOR PCI busboards.
These drivers will be included in the software package for the
MEDIATOR PCI busboard. We expect completing work on the first
version of this software within two weeks.


ELBOX Computer
Mariusz Wloczysiak, Press Department


Addendum
Please find the enclosed only and last Voodoo3 driver in Alfa
version for MEDIATOR written by Mr. Frank Mariak. This driver
was prepared solely for presentation purposes and may only be
used in this way.
This driver was never bundled with MEDIATORs, contrary to the
information in the DCE & VFD's announcement.
Please consult the enclosed text file disclaimers by Mr. Mariak
in this respect.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 1 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by ElfKing on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Even with such a lack of developers/developments/news/inovations/Amigans/
web sites/etc. for the Classic Amiga,... what a sad, sad situation our
beloved Classic Amiga world has become.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 2 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Electric Head on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (ElfKing):
Yup. I'm glad to see Elbox arent taking it lying down though. I'm not convinced
as to how effective this software of theirs is going to be (its going to have to be
Cgx Compatible.. right?), but I dont see what else they can do. But a big *Thank you*
goes out to them for being the first to give us working PCI, on schedule, no B$.
Cheers!
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 3 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by XDelusion on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Electric Head):
Ya the best of luck to them, glad they are looking out for our interests, even the unimaginable word "free" came up in there a few times, now that is nice. :)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 4 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by bbuilder on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Hopefully this attack by DCE does not destroy ELBOX, I would LOVE to buy their
"Mediator evolution" board for my A4k.
(I need better virge card, if Voodoo3 is available, it is only some extra for me.)
Some war moves which phase5 did were really unprofessional & stooped, now
it seems that DCE continues on that path.
ELBOX is amazing company, no bullshit & lies & war. They are professionals.
PPC monopoly is a bad thing, ELBOX guys, I wish you all the best!
(hopefully AmiJoe appears also, if it does, I'm sure ELBOX is capable
of delivering the PCI daughtercard also for it (AmiJoe does have PCI bridge)
in few weeks.)
-bbuilder
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 5 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Mark Bowman on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Electric Head):
Yeah,
good for them I say... They would certainly have grounds to take legal action considering that there would appear to be a binding contract in place verbal or otherwise. This isn't going to help anyone though so it's far better that they have decided to stop worrying about it and get on with completing the PCI solution.
I currenttly don't own an Amiga so pardon my ignorance but what happened to P96? It would seem like this would be a good hookup.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 6 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Kay Are Ulvestad on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
This was the clarification I was waiting for. I see little reason to
distrust what has been said here. It explains the initial Elbox/VFD
press release, and presents a believable explanation for what happened
next. After all, if VFD had come to Elbox and asked for money to
continue their work, Elbox would have to be nothing short of
mind-bogglingly stupid to turn them down (unless they had a rock
steady contract to back their claims for continued development). After
all, since Elbox used Voodoo3 in their own advertising they must have
expected the drivers to be in development. Another sign that the
VFD/DCE pressrelease took them by surprise is that it took Elbox
several days to make a response.
Elbox Computer in Poland has a nice, clean PCI implementation at a
very resonable price. They also have an excellent record for
fulfilling their promises. I already have two or three Elbox designs,
all next to flawless implementations. I have little doubt that I will
be satisfied with Mediator, and that Elbox will deliver working
drivers for Voodoo3 soon enough.
I have chosen my side. I'm sad that I had to make a choice in the
first place.
Kay
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 7 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by david b on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
elbox,DCE who ever!.
PCI adaptors are out and elbox,dce are competing with each other - WHY!.
The hardware design for pci on amiga has all was been there(micronik).
Why dont they worry about getting drivers out instead?.P5 hagge&partner has risen again.
I've cancelled the order for a mediator because a.I'm fed up with this squabbling between amiga makers and b.i've bought A4000(a1200 are for kids).
time to wait and see.
n.b dont respond by saying "pre-orders will continue elbox making the A4000"
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 8 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Johan Rönnblom on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
It's good to see that Elbox are not sinking to the argumentation level
of some of their "supporters". Now I hope that DCE/VFD will release
their version of the story.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 9 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Good, now lets hope that this "first version" of the driver is more
than an alpha!
And I think Elbox _must_ address this SharkPPC software implementation
issue quickly. The main reason for me (and probably others) to buy
a Mediator is the SharkPPC. So I want to hear what they say about
the points Ralph mentioned... Do they know yet "how to make the
shark work flawless"? What about existing PPC appz? What about
POS/WOS/MOS ?
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 10 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Radfoo on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Nice to see Elbox producing a responce so quickly.
Its good they have stated they can produce a Voodo 3 driver, cant wait to get them up and running on my system!!
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 11 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by olav p. on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
It's good to see that Elbox will deliver the Voodoo drivers somehow. And looking in these threads out there, seems that the majority of the Amiga community is on Elbox's side on this whole issue, perhaps just because they actually deliver what they promise on schdule, and the Amiga community is so tired of waitings and cancellations. Great job Elbox, good luck!
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 12 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Homer Coble on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (david b):
David, seems to me Elbox is working hard on the drivers and have delivered a working PCI solution. The PCI slots on the Micronik were "inactive" slots. Otherwise someone would have written drivers for them. Wait if you will but the Mediator is currently the only active PCI slots actually available for purchase on the Amiga.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 13 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Electric Head on 16-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
You know, I think DCE and VGR have dug themselves a grave here. I'm sure their original
plan was to get as many people as possible to buy *their* PCI implementation instead of
Elbox's. But like everyone here probably knows, the amiga community is more than just a
group of helpless 'consumers'. It will, at least, make people think twice when considering
their PCI board over Elbox's.
Saying that though, I'd still like to hear from both DCE and VGR regarding this.. just so
we've got more solid stuff to go on.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 14 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Electric Head on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (david b):
I've cancelled the order for a mediator because a.I'm fed up wit> b.i've bought A4000(a1200 are for kids).
A1200's were probably originally bought for kids because of its games machine image, and admittedly I got mine back when I was a shortarse :) If you offered me an A4000 right now i'd take it, but for now my A1200T does me nicely thanks, and I dont consider myself as a kiddie any more :o)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 15 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Kenshiro on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
During the past 9 months Amiga did... : Comment 59 of 59
Part of the "beef" that certain ppl have with mediator hardware is the 8mb limit and therefore
the bankswitching, this will happen as far as i underestand due to the amount
of memory the a1200 side can access at a time (to do with zorro space or something).
Now as long as the cpu card/accelerator is on the amiga side then you have this problem, but
what if the cpu was on the pci bus side, ie if elbox made a "a1200 150pin cpu slot ->pci slot
converter"
board that converts/connects the regular accelerators to the pci slot, you plug in your
accelerator as if its a pci card, (probably like how the sharkppc will work?) and then
maybe have the 020 boot and hand control over to the mediator (pci side)? then relax or
something, while the rest of the hardware does whatever.
Is this worthwhile/possible/totally wrong?
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 16 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Electric Head on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Kenshiro):
I was kinda thinking something like that too. It would make cheap and powerful classic migs possible if you could sell towered up systems w/ mediators, no 68k accelerator, just a sharkPPC instead (plus the obvious cheap sound card, usb, mpeg blah blah). The 020 starts its usual stuff, then maybe via an os3.5 style updated setpatch, it hands control over to the g3/g4, which then emulates the 68k when it needs to. Okay so I'm no hardware expert, but its just nice to dream :o)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 17 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Darrin on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Thanks Elbox for the clarification. I'm still waiting for my Power Tower from Power Computing to arrive (along with some other goodies) and as soon as my A1200 motherboard is relocated then an order for the Mediator will follow. Roll on the A3000 version - if it functions as well as we all hope it does then my A3000 will get a "Mediator Makeover" too.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 18 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Tony Gore on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Way to go Elbox. I hope you do very well in your Mediator and Shark PPC sales. I will certainly invest in your products. This will be a nice setup to run the new Ami on as well, so the investment will be worth it. It will be worth it for me just to bring the Classic Amiga for once up to current standings. It is good to see you coming back with a clear focus on the ultimate end results, regardless of the setbacks.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 19 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Nian on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
The mediator does sound like the cleanest way to upgrade and keeps the best
backward compatibility by having the original cpu cards still in the system.
Sod the probably very ugly and cumbersum DCE pci. Anyway lets hope the a4000
version comes out soon and that it atleast has 1 Zorro3 slot. And what about
a a4k tower mediator for the Power Towers? I would much rather 2xZorro3 5xPCI
2xVideo. Atleast then we can keep our much loved zorro3 cards and the all
important scan doubler.
Anyway on the SharkPPC, why don't they make it more attractive by adding USB
to it. Then we wouldn't need much more, then again we also need decent IDE.
Mmm USB and IDE is a must have and with the current solution it would be very
difficult to fit even IDE into the system.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 20 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by bbuilder on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
So, I'm waiting for the a4k version of mediator and
my friend offered me his Voodoo3 2000 PCI card.
What should I offer, $100 ?
-bbuilder
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 21 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by bbuilder on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (bbuilder):
Frank speaks: http://www.amiga-news.de/archiv/001018.shtml in Deutch
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 22 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by S. de Vries on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (bbuilder):
$ 100 is way to much. The cost here in Holland less than $ 80,- new!!
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 23 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Dirk on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
I cant help thinking that Elbox like to make enemies for themselves... they seem to love writing Press Releases which are offensive against other Amiga companies..
First against Eyetech with the Predator, then against DCE and VGR about this!
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 24 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Electric Head on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 23 (Dirk):
If someone started spreading false information about my product, I'm sure I'd get a bit pissed.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 25 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Lightning on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
Huh,
sounds to me like Elbox have been screwed over and are trying to make the best of a bad situation...
in the current climate all this argument can do is reproduce the kind of confusion that occured with the "WarpOS" "PowerUP" situation...
what a complete and utter disaster for the amiga consumer
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 26 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Olivier Fabre on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Nian):
I neither want USB nor IDE..
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 27 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Darrin on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reference to the "only and last Voodoo3 driver in Alpha" mentioned in Elbox's press release, does anyone know where can I download it? I'd like to make a "presentation"... honest :) - especially before DCE make some legal move to get it banned from distribution.
And from where can the ViRGE driver be downloaded?
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 28 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by bbuilder on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 23 (Dirk):
>I cant help thinking that Elbox like to make enemies for themselves...
>they seem to love writing Press Releases which
>are offensive against other Amiga companies..
åååå
For me at least it seems that Elbox guys are the good ones and
Eytech & DCE are the bad boys.
>First against Eyetech with the Predator, then against DCE and VGR about this!
Why I remember that Eyetech first attacked Elbox.
...
After reading the response of Frank Mariak, I think he is not a complete
bastard (I'm not sending my CGX4 drivers back). There really is not any
single party to blame.
Never the less, DCE & Frank Mariak & Eyetech & Elbox f*cked things up and
it is a bad thing for the Amiga community.
-bbuilder
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 29 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 27 (Darrin):
> In reference to the "only and last Voodoo3 driver in Alpha" mentioned in Elbox's press release, does
> anyone know where can I download it? I'd like to make a "presentation"... honest :) - especially
http://www.realdreams.cz/amiga/files/voodoo3.lha
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 30 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Artur Pietruk on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 23 (Dirk):
: I cant help thinking that Elbox like to make enemies for themselves...
: they seem to love writing Press Releases which are offensive against
: other Amiga companies..
: First against Eyetech with the Predator, then against DCE and VGR
: about this!
: Posted by Dirk (194.153.3.201) on 18-Oct-2000
And who is talking about that?
--8<--
arturp~,0> host 194.153.3.201
201.3.153.194.IN-ADDR.ARPA domain name pointer eyetech.compulink.co.uk
--8<--
It looks like you are from eytech? So, could you please explain us why had eyetech attacked Elbox soon after Mediator was announced?
PS. When most of people using internet belive in roumours, things like that: "Someone said that someone said that...", it is hard for any company to show, that roumours are false. Do not belive in what is said here on ann and other places. Watch the facts, and judge for your self who is right :)
--- Artur Pietruk
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 31 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Darrin on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 29 (Anonymous):
Thanks for your help :)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 32 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Frank Mariak on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 29 (Anonymous):
Thanks to ELBOX, this alpha driver is now floating around everywhere (They attached it to their press announcement), although it was supposed to be used at shows only .... Is that good style from ELBOX ? At least they have a good argument now that they never released that on their own :D I can understand that some people don't care but please don't send bug reports, either .......
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 33 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Mike on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (Artur Pietruk):
ROTFLMAO
Man, good detective work!
Dirk, I call on you to admit your poor behavior and apologize for not disclosing your um, how shall we say.... 'biased' perspective :)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 34 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Mike on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 32 (Frank Mariak):
Please attempt to explain your point of view in English. I read the translation of your recent interview, but frankly, I can't understand most of the points. One thing I did come away with is that you appeared to be suprised that people are pissed at you. In my opinion, they have every right to be, but I'd like to hear you answer several questions first, and generally address the situation.
Specifically:
Elbox has released significant evidence that points to an agreement between them and you to write CGX 3 and 4 drivers for both Voodoo and S3 PCI cards. Are you saying there was no agreement, or the agreement was of a different nature? If the agreement was of a different nature, what specific drivers did you agree to do?
Also, are you going to finish CGX 4 drivers for S3 and Voodoo for the Mediator? If no, why not?
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 35 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Mike on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 32 (Frank Mariak):
/**********
Thanks to ELBOX, this alpha driver is now floating around everywhere (They attached it to their press announcement), although it was supposed to be used at shows only .... Is that good style from ELBOX ?
*************/
As I pointed out b4, it appears you left them high and dry and reneged on your agreement, so I don't see how you have a right to complain about them not continuing to live up to an agreement you've already broken! LOL at this
They did qualify the alpha release as such, rather than try to say it was a final release or anything!!
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 36 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by bbuilder on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 32 (Frank Mariak):
WOW!
Now we got all Eyetech, VGR and Elbox ((?Artur?)) people on this forum... 8)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 37 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Bill Gates on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 36 (bbuilder):
Why don't you all buy a PC with Windows and then you can ALL have lot's of free PCI drivers.
Love & Bubbles,
Uncle Bill @ Micro$haft
:)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 38 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Artur Pietruk on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 36 (bbuilder):
: WOW!
: Now we got all Eyetech, VGR and Elbox ((?Artur?)) people on this
: forum... 8)
Artur? Do you mean that I am working for Elbox? Nooo :)))) I do not work for elbox :)))) I have never worked for them :) Why do you think that I'm working for them? :)
--- Artur Pietruk
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 39 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by StormLord on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Kenshiro):
Sorry dude...
But that's not possible because you must know that a regular accelerator that connects to standard expansion slot of A1200 has also the limitation of only 24bit adressing to this port and thats because these accelerators made with this memory window in mind.
But ofcourse they can develop a dual cpu 68k/ppc as phase 5 only this could connect on a pci directly.
But again we have the problem of where the machine boots. The implementation of a ppc in existing motherboards designs is ok by starting with 68k and enabling ppc by software, but I think is just a spare of time to do this with an 68k cpu.
As I can see the amiga gets the PPC way... finally....
Lets dream about new motherboard with NATIVE pci slot and buses to cpu's
Something like BoXer promished....
I don't care about AGA or ECS anymore if that's the main problem of these implementations.
Give US new hardware DONT PATCH ANYMORE THE OLDIES MOBOS.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 40 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by bbuilder on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (Artur Pietruk):
;))
Ok, it was a long shot, but worth a try. ;D
I thought that your surname might be east european...
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 41 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Vader on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (bbuilder):
I think that if Elbox do such thing like DCE did (exclusive agreement)
every other firms would attack them, takt they want to become a monopoly.
The truth is that Elbox is the only company that produce and sells PCI
slots. Just after their announcement, some firms seemed to wake up to late
and announced their won stuff (byt they knew, it is a long way to release
point). So every trick should do fine for them. Elbox didn't want to kick
other by "buying Voodoo3 rights". The know, that their opponents have nothing
to compete. What others do then? "Let's stop Elbox by hitting them in balls".
Just like Andrew Golota ;-))).
After other companies announcements I thought, it will be cool situation for
us - Amigans. Three companies with their stuff, it never was so beautifull.
Mow I know that only Elbox can offer me right stuff... and without cheap
tricks like others.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 42 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Johan Rönnblom on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (Mike):
Mike wrote:
: Elbox has released significant evidence that points to an agreement between them and you to write CGX 3 and 4 drivers for both Voodoo
: and S3 PCI cards.
Where is this evidence? I seem to have missed it. All I've seen is an
account by Elbox that *they* think there was such an agreement. Sorry,
but that is not evidence. They have not posted the agreement itself
for all to judge whether there was a valid agreement at all, or
whether it is only a misunderstanding.
Please remember that no one has made any claims that Elbox have paid
Frank Mariak anything to do this. So is it so hard to believe that
he thinks it was not a binding deal? That he thinks Elbox should be
happy if he writes any drivers at all? Until I've seen the actual
agreement, I'm not going to make any definite statements about what it
contains or not.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 43 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Mike on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 42 (Johan Rönnblom):
/**************************
Where is this evidence? I seem to have missed it. All I've seen is an
account by Elbox that *they* think there was such an agreement. Sorry,
but that is not evidence. They have not posted the agreement itself
for all to judge whether there was a valid agreement at all, or
whether it is only a misunderstanding.
*****************************/
Agreed, but Mr. Mariak hasn't rebutted it, and in fact (in the above thread) said he isn't going to.
However, Mariak said that the alpha voodoo drivers released by Elbox was "my software". The common meaning of that would be that he wote it. This fact and the fact that he was sending them to Elbox tends to imply some agreement and cooperation between the two of them.
Does it prove Elbox's claims w/100% certainty, no, but IMHO, it gives them some additional credence.
/***********************************
Please remember that no one has made any claims that Elbox have paid
Frank Mariak anything to do this. So is it so hard to believe that
he thinks it was not a binding deal?
***********************************/
Yes, some of the first things you learn in contract law are:
1. A contract need not be written. It can be verbal. In some cases, it need not even be verbal!
2. Consideration for a contract does not have to be cash. I think it's even mentioned in Mariak's interview (if I understand the translation correctly), that he was receiving a tangible benefit for his services in the inclusion of CGX 3 drivers and promotion of the commercial CGX 4 drivers. In short, the interview suggests that he undertook to write the drivers with the understanding that Elbox would distribute CGX3 and promote CGX4, which would promote lagging sales for the latter.
That is the sort of tangible return promise that is valid consideration in most any court.
/**********************************
That he thinks Elbox should be
happy if he writes any drivers at all? Until I've seen the actual
agreement, I'm not going to make any definite statements about what it
contains or not.
**************/
Fair enough, some people are harder to please than others :)
My point is just that, if you look at all of the evidence, I think it tends to show that what really happened is closer to Elbox's version.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 44 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Tony Gore on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
And, _if_ he accepted and used the hardware (Voodoo3, etc) supplied by Elbox to write drivers for another company, that in itself says everything to me. Hope he at least returned their hardware.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 45 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Kay Are Ulvestad on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 42 (Johan Rönnblom):
If you doubt there was a deal between VFD and Elbox, check out
http://www.vgr.com/mediator/pressrelease1.txt
This was a joint pressrelease for VFD and Elbox. I doubt that we would
have seen this pressrelease if there wasn't a deal between the
companies. Now, I don't think that this pressrelease mentions Voodoo3
drivers as a minimum specifically (not Virge either), but I find it
very likely that it was part of the deal. Elbox used the Voodoo3 in PR
after this, and an alpha driver was indeed produced.
Kay
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 46 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Mark Bowman on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 29 (Anonymous):
Hmmm...
Interesting but its a shame I guess that the source code was not included. I don't think an alpha driver is something that you want to have on your system for a long time.
I guess Elbox or whoever didn't want to push their luck.
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 47 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 40 (bbuilder):
> I thought that your surname might be east european...
Ah, then the odds are narrowed down to only >200,000,000:1. :)
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 48 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Kay Are Ulvestad on 17-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 42 (Johan Rönnblom):
If you doubt there was a deal between VFD and Elbox, check out
http://www.vgr.com/mediator/pressrelease1.txt
This was a joint pressrelease for VFD and Elbox. I doubt that we would
have seen this pressrelease if there wasn't a deal between the
companies. Now, I don't think that this pressrelease mentions Voodoo3
drivers as a minimum specifically (not Virge either), but I find it
very likely that it was part of the deal. Elbox used the Voodoo3 in PR
after this, and an alpha driver was indeed produced.
Kay
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 49 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Amifan on 18-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 8 (Johan Rönnblom):
Or their competetors.
They could try to flame the G-rex, but they didn't.
That's professional, unlike some other guy in here and Eyetech
Elbox on Mediator/Voodoo3 driver controversy : Comment 50 of 67ANN.lu
Posted by Amifan on 18-Oct-2000 22:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 42 (Johan Rönnblom):
Your working for DCE, CGFX or are a close friend of Ralph Schmidt.
You sound just like him. Same arguments against elbox.
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