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[News] SharkPPC delayedANN.lu
Posted on 11-Feb-2001 18:58 GMT by Christian Kemp21 comments
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Alan Watson writes: Apparently the SharkPPC has been delayed by around 6 months. If you look at the SharkPPC page on Power Computing`s website, it says that developer boards will not be ready till June, with retail boards in production some time in the 2nd half of 2001.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 1 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Paul Qureshi on 10-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
I really hope this isn't true.
I got the impression the Shark PPC was due very soon. Elbox are usually
good about this kind of thing. I have little faith in Power however, so
who knows who is right?
It's a shame, as if I could get a Mediator/G4 for my A4000 today I would
gladly pay out for it.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 2 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Amifan on 10-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
Somone at the Meditor mailinglist heard this rumour and asked if it was true......the guy from vgr is also on the list and posted it to his side, and suddenly ll the news sides consider it as *news*.
It's a rumour from some guy which *heard* that from PowerC and just asked if we (on the mediator list) could confirm that.
No we can't!!!! Wait 'till Elbox(who is also on that list) confirms or denies it before posting it as *news*....
It's only confusing ppl....
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 3 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Frederik Yssing on 10-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
I have one question
What kind of kernel will it use ????
WarpUp I hope, but can any one tell me what it will use....
KInd regards Frederik
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 4 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Amifan):
I don`t think I`ve caused any confusion by posting this.If I
hadn`t,somebody else would have.Anyway,if any confusion has been
caused,it is by the changed release dates on Power Computing`s
SharkPPC webpage.And I can`t see Power doing this because of a
`rumour`.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 5 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by JKD on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
As far as I know, there has been no official announcement by Elbox
which software the Shark will use, other than some 'quote' from
WOA2000 stating it's for AmigaDE.
I have lots of opinions around this, but the only clear one being that
Elbox should communicate more ;-)
Personally I'd like to see solution that can run all existing Amiga
PPC software...and if that solution waits in line for the
AmigaDE...then so be it!
In the meantime, here's hoping I get to be an AmigaONE beta tester :-)
Steve
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 6 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Dave on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
Elbox also said in the WOA2k IRC that it could run
WarpOS "if H&P wanted to write the driver for it".
If they could convince H&P to do it, I'm sure more
people would go for the Shark. I'd love to use the
Shark, but I'd rather be able to run WarpOS stuff
as well as AmigaDE.
There have been a number of delays recently, with
drivers and such, so it's not inconcievable that
the Shark is delayed also. If it is delayed, then
it's apparent that Elbox have taken on more work
than they can deal with. Obviously they want to
keep people buying the Mediator, but their tactic
of not releasing the DDK is backfiring. Driver
updates are slow in coming, and need a few revisions
before working well.
I don't see what they can achieve by keeping it a
secret - perhaps they wanted to make sure no-one could
steal their drivers for other PCI solutions. Or they
want to keep the hardware a bit more hidden.
I don't think anyone would steal the drivers, for two reasons.
1 - all the other PCI solutions have the same drivers
as the Mediator already. 2 - Developers with no connection
to Elbox would probably write their own driver, but make it
so it could be recompiled easily for the other PCI solutions.
There wouldn't be any point in keeping hardware design a
secret at this stage - the other solutions must be close to being
complete designs if they are not already (besides, how much info
about the hardware design could you get from pci.library?).
In short, the DDK needs to be released. Even if it is only to
a few developers - make them sign NDAs if you don't trust them.
But we need the openess to take advantage of the many varied
possible PCI cards. I sure don't want to see Elbox struggling
to do everything by themselves.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 7 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Amifan on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 4 (Alan Watson):
If it isn't confirmed by the manufacturer it's a rumour....
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 8 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (Amifan):
Okay.Lets see what Elbox say.I hope it`s all a mistake but they have been pretty quiet recently....
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 9 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
It seems Power Computing have changed the dates on their page again.It now says the end of March 2001.:)
Good news.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 10 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Amifan on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (Alan Watson):
Strange uh? maybe some1 or some compagny wants to see this rather strange typo in favour of soon to be released products?
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 11 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Chris on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Dave):
> than they can deal with. Obviously they want to
> keep people buying the Mediator, but their tactic
> of not releasing the DDK is backfiring. Driver
In the IRC conference (WOA2000) Elbox said their
Mediator DDK was available after signing NDA with them.
> I don't see what they can achieve by keeping it a
> secret - perhaps they wanted to make sure no-one could
> steal their drivers for other PCI solutions. Or they
> want to keep the hardware a bit more hidden.
>
> I don't think anyone would steal the drivers, for two reasons.
> 1 - all the other PCI solutions have the same drivers
> as the Mediator already.
Ha ha ha
I can't get hold of ANY other PCI solution.
Have you seen them anywhere in real world?
Eyetech annouinced Predator (3xPCI + 1xAGP + SDRAM)
later renamed for AmigaOne, in early September 2000.
They said it would be available in late September / early October.
Ridiculous.
> 2 - Developers with no connection
> to Elbox would probably write their own driver, but make it
> so it could be recompiled easily for the other PCI solutions.
Recompiling Mediator drivers for other hardware is far
simpler than starting work from the scratch. Maybe it's the reason
why companies other than Elbox say they have drivers only to
those PCI cards, to which Elbox has already released their drivers.
Even P96 guys want to make drivers only to Voodoo3 cards to which
Elbox first gave their own version - before they did anything on their own.
There is plenty of other PCI graphic cards for which they
could write drivers, and it would do good to all Amiga users.
They did not say a word about this path. Why do you think?
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 12 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (Amifan):
Yeah,it`s a bit weird.But all that matters know is that it hopefully hits the market at the end of March.That way I know what to get for my birthday in April:)
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 13 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Kay Are Ulvestad on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (Alan Watson):
:-) Hmm, well my birthday is today...I wont ask for a SharkPPC, but Elbox: How about releasing the v1.2 Voodoo driver as a little present, eh? I believe it is quite a bit overdue by now...
-
Kay
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 14 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
It will be interesting to compare the following solutions :
- AmigaOne 1200/4000
- A1200 with Shark PPC
Personally I have a preference for the 1st solution as it appears that it's in the run, WarpOS and AmigaOs will work on it and it seems reliable (only oneboard with everything on it).
For the SharkPPC, I still don't know if :
- WOS will run on it
- I have to stick with my old 68k or PPC board or if I can sell it away
- if it will allow to add USB, SCSI, AmigaDE etc... as the AmigaOne seems to be give all that.
Surely a press release from Elbox should clarifiy ALL these points.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 15 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Victor on 11-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Ben Yoris):
Such a comparison is in the page:
http://www.elbox.com/Press/Press20001030.html
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 16 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 12-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Victor):
This comparison pages doesn't answer to all my questions :
- "logic for supporting A1200
68k & 68k/PPC turbo card" : what does it mean ? Do I have to stick with my old board ? I don't want to have 3 or 4 processors in my machine ! I want a clean solution.
- not a word about WOS and Amiga OS compatibility through the G3/G4
- not a word about emulating 68k
Reading this page, I have the impression that you need to have :
- a tower
- a Mediator
- a Shark PPC + SDRAM
- a turbo board 68k or PPC + SIMM
The fact that you still need you classic turbo board makes me think that in fact the AmigaOS will run on the Classic turbo board (whether it's an 030, 040 or 060) and that there won't be ANY 68k emulation.
Concerning the G3/G4, it looks as if it's a super expansion CPU board, which will be adressed by I-don't-know-what, no mention of any kernel nor integration into the AmigaOS.
All these facts remain unclear...
Exemple : I have a tower 1200 with a 030 board a Mediator and a Shark PPC+ Voodoo3, I want to play a 3D game, let's say GLQuake : how is it going to work ?
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 17 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Steffen Haeuser on 12-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Victor):
Hi!
Well, *that* press release... I doubt Elbox still has the same opinion they
had when they wrote this release (or at least I hope they don't :) ):
- They talk of 020 speed with 68k Emulations (I reach 040 speed on a 150 MHz
604e system without Backside-Cache even... 020 speed? Comeon, you are not
serious, Elbox guys... even UAE should reach 020 speed - though UAE of course
is not usable for a 68k Emulation for Amiga)
- They talk of the "advantage" of having the old PPC Board still in. All people
who know what a Contextswitch is know this is no advantage. But a big
disadvantage. And now imagine a Contextswitch between three CPUs (the 68k,
the old PPC and the new PPC). Wow :)
But I am sure this old press release is quite outdated and does not reflect
the current opinion of Elbox (at least I hope so :) ).
But maybe it was just a "ours is good, theirs is bad" style press release :)
Steffen
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 18 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Victor on 14-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (Steffen Haeuser):
> - They talk of 020 speed with 68k Emulations (I reach 040 speed on a 150 MHz
> 604e system without Backside-Cache even... 020 speed? Comeon, you are not
Where can you find them to write such things?
They are writing that in the mode they call Amiga Classic-the mode in which
software is executed in the 68k chip-their system is definitely faster from
AmigaOne 1200 (you can still use turbo cards with their hardware).
In the emulated Amiga Clasic mode, system's speeds of the Elbox (mediator &
sharkPPC) and eyetech (AmigaOne 1200 & Mac-type PPC card) solutions will
depend on the installed PPC processor. For the same PPC chips, the
speeds may be the same.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 19 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Victor on 14-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 16 (Ben Yoris):
> This comparison pages doesn't answer to all my questions :
>
> - "logic for supporting A1200
> 68k & 68k/PPC turbo card" : what does it mean ?
It means that you can use 68k & 68k/PPC turbo cards with Mediator.
> Do I have to stick with my old board ?
You don't, but you can.
> I don't want to have 3 or 4
> processors in my machine ! I want a clean solution.
If you want to have a 'clean solution,' take AmigaOne from bPlan and not
AmigaOne 1200/4000 from Eyetech.
> - not a word about WOS and Amiga OS compatibility through the G3/G4
> - not a word about emulating 68k
Read again carefully. They write about it.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 20 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 15-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Victor):
> It means that you can use 68k & 68k/PPC turbo cards with Mediator.
Why the hell I'd need a 603 or a 68k if I have a G3 or G4 on the SharkPPC ? Stupid, no ?
> Do I have to stick with my old board ?
>You don't, but you can.
Strange...
> I don't want to have 3 or 4
> processors in my machine ! I want a clean solution.
If you want to have a 'clean solution,' take AmigaOne from bPlan and not
AmigaOne 1200/4000 from Eyetech.
The AmigaOne 1200/4000 IS a clean solution : one board and that's all.
The bPlan board : maybe you could share info with us ?
> - not a word about WOS and Amiga OS compatibility through the G3/G4
> - not a word about emulating 68k
>Read again carefully. They write about it.
Then please gimme a hand on this because the press release is quite mysterious.
SharkPPC delayed : Comment 21 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by j on 15-Feb-2001 23:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (Ben Yoris):
> Why the hell I'd need a 603 or a 68k if I have a G3 or G4 on the SharkPPC ? Stupid, no ?
I like the idea of using old 68k turbo. Then there's guaranteed compatibility with old software, like demos and games.
And I don't have to pay extra in PPC, because there isn't 68k raising the costs.
With Mediator+SharkPPC I won't need second Amiga as "demo-computer" as I would need if there would be only G3/4 cpu in it :)
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