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[News] Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set ArchitectureANN.lu
Posted on 28-Jan-2002 16:39 GMT by Christophe Decanini38 comments
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Here is the official Motorola Press release. More technical information was available in the What's New box, MPC7455 product on this page. The link is not working righ now. It was available a few minutes before. I guess the are doing changes
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 1 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2002 16:06 GMT
And Apple have already released their dual 1GHz G4 computers!
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 2 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Gabriele Svelto on 28-Jan-2002 16:13 GMT
Well, IBM POWER4 is already running at 1,3 GHz since some months, maybe they mean the first commercial PowerPC to reach 1 GHz
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 3 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Graham on 28-Jan-2002 16:42 GMT
Heh, and the useful information:
Suggested retail pricing for the MPC7445 at 800 MHz is $125 in 10k quantities. Suggested retail pricing for the MPC7455 at 1 GHz is $295 in 10k quantities.
Nice. Especially if you utilise the L3 cache facility on the 1GHz processor, that gives you 4GB/s bandwidth and thus negates the need for DDR main memory.
Graham
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 4 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by cOrpse on 28-Jan-2002 16:47 GMT
os 4 will fly on one of those :)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 5 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2002 16:53 GMT
In reply to Comment 3 (Graham):
Good, Motorola succeeded in getting those 1GHz parts out AT LAST!
Nice price, a sure candidate for Pegasos I would say.
Still I remain unimpressed, there already were overclocked G4 1066MHz afaik
and that was with the old and power-sucking core. Motorola better release
1,2GHz G4e real soon, because the 15% jump from 867 to 1000MHz in 1/2 year
just doesn't cut it!
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 6 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 28-Jan-2002 17:25 GMT
In reply to Comment 5 (Anonymous):
Well, that processor, was sent to several test sites AFAIK.
That one in mac.gr I was talking about was probably an overclocked
part.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 7 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by sutro on 28-Jan-2002 17:33 GMT
In reply to Comment 5 (Anonymous):
Hey, don't believe in the "GHz myth" !!!
It all depends on the software that runs the hardware. If it is efficiently implemented than you don't have problems unless you are so desperate that a 15 mins gain off DVD-ripping is so crucial to you.
Anyway, G5 should be nice ...
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 8 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2002 17:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (sutro):
Right, sutro. I think it was just my ego that was talking. :-)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 9 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2002 17:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (sutro):
Still, PPC doesn't quite catch up to x86 with these! :-P
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 10 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Radfoo on 28-Jan-2002 18:12 GMT
I doubt we will see those sort of prices if an Amiga company has to buy 10k in one go!
Maybe Elbox, Eyetech and BPlan could club together to buy a big batch:)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 11 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by cdfr on 28-Jan-2002 18:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (Anonymous):
>Still, PPC doesn't quite catch up to x86 with these! :-P
Who cares ? x86 does not run AmigaOS4, Morphos or MAC OSX :)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 12 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by [JC] on 28-Jan-2002 19:13 GMT
Technically OS X could run on x86, Darwin already does, all Apple would have to do is compile it... of course this will never happen, but :)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 13 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by quenthal on 28-Jan-2002 19:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (Anonymous):
Hmm.. I just checked that Apple's page about dual 1Ghz powermac.. what's wrong with that Quake3 benchmark - only 115fps? With GeForce4 MX.. and 62fps with Radeon 7500. Hopefully future Amigas gain more frames. Quake3 is an old game, and that fps don't promise good future with upcoming, more demanding releases in game market.
(Well, I have to admit that even that speed makes current AmigaDE -games fly.. :-)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 14 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by quenthal on 28-Jan-2002 19:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 13 (quenthal):
That page I talked about is http://www.apple.com/powermac/graphics.html
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 15 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Kay Are Ulvestad on 28-Jan-2002 20:01 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (Radfoo):
Add in Merlancia, and there could be a slim possibility. But I wouldn't hold my
breath, Amiga companies have a tendency of shunning that kind of mutually beneficial
deals. Remember how long it took for Elbox and Hyperion to come to an agreement
over Warp3d? If I see Elbox, bPlan and Eyetech come to such an agreement, I would
be extremely impressed, though.
-
Kay
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 16 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by victor # on 28-Jan-2002 20:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 13 (quenthal):
This is not a good idea to compare a CPU to a dedicated 3D GFX processor...
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 17 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by victor # on 28-Jan-2002 21:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 13 (quenthal):
Ohh, BTW, I think "GeForce4 MX" is a misprint. There is no such a product of NVidia, yet. At least, there is no mention of it on their web-site. So, I think it is really GeForce2 MX. Which means the faster CPU gives a nice boost also to 3D GFX (or more correctly, it does not slows it as much down).
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 18 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by quenthal on 28-Jan-2002 21:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (victor #):
Nope, it is gf4 (four). nvidia just signed with apple.. and notice that ati radeon 7500 gets much lower fps than that geforce.
>This is not a good idea to compare a CPU to a dedicated 3D GFX processor...
Well, as you already saw, graph ain't comparing cpu to dedicated gpu.
However, maybe mac version of q3 isn't optimized well enough. Still it makes me sad to see that dual G4 running 1ghz can't beat my old sucky pc with this benchmark - even with better graphics cards (radeon 7500, gf4mx).
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 19 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by cOrpse on 28-Jan-2002 21:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (Anonymous):
its not the mhz its what u do with it that counts and x86 sucks :P
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 20 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by victor # on 28-Jan-2002 21:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (quenthal):
Nope^2... This is the actual press-release from NVidia:
"NVIDIA Graphics Technology Now Standard in all Apple Desktops
MACWORLD SAN FRANCISCO–JANUARY 7, 2002 - NVIDIA Corporation today announced that with Apple's introduction of the new iMac with GeForce2 MX, NVIDIA graphics are now standard across all Macintosh desktop platforms. The performance and quality of NVIDIA's graphics combined with Apple's revolutionary ergonomic iMac design provides consumers with an affordable, high-performance desktop for today's exciting digital solutions."
(BTW, GF4 *MX* would be strange also because MX (cheaper, limited performance) versions always come after the normal one. But we'd have heard about the normal version in that case, for sure.)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 21 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Graham on 28-Jan-2002 21:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (victor #):
That is for the iMac2.
The GeForce 4 and GeForce 4 MX have been known about for a week or so in the online world. I would imagine that Apple are using the lowest end version however....
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 22 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by victor # on 28-Jan-2002 22:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 21 (Graham):
OK, I am convinced. I wasn't online too much in the last week... Just one week, ehh... :) It is still unusual they're coming out with the MX the same time as with the normal...
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 23 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2002 23:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 22 (victor #):
Maybe that is because it is a GeForce3MX (NV17) relabeled to GeForce4MX...
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 24 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2002 23:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (quenthal):
well.. don't expect to get ANYTHING from the 2nd cpu when runing Q3,
so consider it as a single G4 at least...
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 25 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Gabriele Svelto on 28-Jan-2002 23:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 ([JC]):
> Technically OS X could run on x86, Darwin already does, all Apple would have > to do is compile it... of course this will never happen, but :)
This is only partially true, the kernel can run on x86 (it does almost) but it needs quite some porting work. But that's only memory/device management and multitasking. MacOS X interface, all the drivers, etc... should be rewritten from scratch.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 26 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by RudyG on 29-Jan-2002 06:47 GMT
Yo! What is this an Apple Forum?! Get off the fruit cart already!
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 27 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Jack on 29-Jan-2002 07:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (Radfoo):
Both pegasos and A1 are supposed to have same processor pinout, and eyetech say they intend to make a Mac-style ZIF adapter, so users can buy a bare motherboard and add in a processor from a Mac dealer. It therefore shouldn't matter too much if eyetech/bPlan/Merlancia etc can't justify a 10k purchase. Apple (and the larger mac dealers) almost certainly can.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 28 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 29-Jan-2002 11:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 27 (Jack):
>Both pegasos and A1 are supposed to have same processor pinout,
>
Huh? Custom Slot1 != custom Slot1 :-)
>
>and eyetech say they intend to make a Mac-style ZIF adapter,
>
ZIF is dead.
>
>so users can buy a bare motherboard and add in a processor from
>a Mac dealer.
>
Yes, old hardware for a ridiculous price!
>
>It therefore shouldn't matter too much if eyetech/bPlan/Merlancia
>etc can't justify a 10k purchase.
>
Maybe they will get 1k lots of they nicely talk to Motorola?
>
>Apple (and the larger mac dealers) almost certainly can.
>
Apple will most likely suck all the good CPUs for its own use. :-\
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 29 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Ole-Egil Hvitmyren on 29-Jan-2002 12:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Gabriele Svelto):
POWER != PowerPC
Both are forks from the same tree, the PowerPC 601. PowerPC 603 and upwards have a lot of different characteristics from the POWER series. And IBM's PowerPC branch is WAY underdeveloped.
And the G4 has been capable of 1GHz a LONG time (like a year or so), but you had to overclock it. If it's possible to assume Motorolas usual ratings, these should be oc'able to at least 1.25GHz without frying them. Given some extra cooling, that is. Overclocking ppc is just a matter of shifting the multiplier jumpers, you know :)
I also noticed the specs and ordering info on the 8540 is out, this is the first embedded chip based on the "Book E", aka "G5", core. Was drooling all yesterday reading the specs on www.mot-sps.com ;)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 30 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 29-Jan-2002 12:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (Anonymous):
>Yes, old hardware for a ridiculous price!
It is ridiculous how cheap they are! (when compared to BPPC/CSPPC)
It is also ridiculous how powerfull they are! (when compared to BPPC/CSPPC)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 31 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Lennart Fridén on 29-Jan-2002 15:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Gabriele Svelto):
The POWER architecture != PowerPC architecture IIRC. Can't verify it for certain as I haven't got my PPC documentation available ATM.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 32 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 29-Jan-2002 19:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (priest):
>It is ridiculous how cheap they are! (when compared to BPPC/CSPPC)
>It is also ridiculous how powerfull they are! (when compared to BPPC/CSPPC)
>
It's not comparable. They are just PPC Chips + Cache on a small board with
a connector. The PowerUP boards have 2 different architecture CPUs, an own
RAM controller, gfxcard interface, SCSI - very complicated design.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 33 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 30-Jan-2002 06:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 32 (Anonymous):
>>It is ridiculous how cheap they are! (when compared to BPPC/CSPPC)
>>It is also ridiculous how powerfull they are! (when compared to BPPC/CSPPC)
>>
>It's not comparable. They are just PPC Chips + Cache on a small board with
>a connector. The PowerUP boards have 2 different architecture CPUs, an own
>RAM controller, gfxcard interface, SCSI - very complicated design.
From your previous comment I got the feeling that you were laughing at PPCs on ZIF socket. Are you now insisting that p5/DCE PPC cards (that are more expensive, slower and unavailable) are better?
There are not that many options for a Amiga OS user. 300-500Mhz PPC with L2 cache is HUGE improvement to what we have today.
Perhaps you were just trying to disparage AmigaOne?
AmigaOne is not ready, not for a while, let's comment when we have some benchmarks.
(FYI from eyetech: "A universal 'Slot 1' type CPU connector will be provided with adaptors being available for most popular pinouts / form factors of Mac-type G3/G4 CPUs.")
What I would like to know though, what kind of PPC board pegasos will have (I know they are custom cards)?
How will they compare to PowerMac cards, like the PPC's on ZIF socket?
(I have seldom seen p5(bplan) guys do cheap & powerfull HW (powerfull, yes. cheap, no.), but if they manage it this time I will be 2x happy.)
IMHO: If we want to keep up with PPC developments, the CPU slot specification should be open to third parties.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 34 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 30-Jan-2002 07:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 33 (priest):
>From your previous comment I got the feeling that you were laughing at PPCs
>on ZIF socket. Are you now insisting that p5/DCE PPC cards (that are more
>expensive, slower and unavailable) are better?
>
I did neither. Fact is that ZIF is a dead end, the later Macs all use some
kind of highdensity connector which is not documented so there are no 3rd
party accelerators I know of.
PowerUP cards are better feature-wise and therefore they are more expensive.
But you really cannot compare them to Mac-ZIFs, they are two pair of shoes
(and another generation of CPU, too).
>
>There are not that many options for a Amiga OS user. 300-500Mhz PPC with
>L2 cache is HUGE improvement to what we have today.
>
Sure. A question remains - is this actually good enough?
I wouldn't mind paying 50 Euro more for a CPU that is twice as fast, would
_you_? I don't think bplan get their G3-400 for free and L2 Cache is not
included with these early generation G3s. So why don't get the real thing:
one of the new PPC750FX or MPC7445 and be happy to leave Amithlon in the
dust? ;-)
>
>Perhaps you were just trying to disparage AmigaOne?
>
No, I'm not.
>
>AmigaOne is not ready, not for a while, let's comment when we have some
>benchmarks. (FYI from eyetech: "A universal 'Slot 1' type CPU connector
>will be provided with adaptors being available for most popular pinouts
>/ form factors of Mac-type G3/G4 CPUs.")
>
We'll see what this is going to look like.
>
>What I would like to know though, what kind of PPC board pegasos will
>have (I know they are custom cards)?
>
Hmm, different ones? They mentioned 1+GHz G3 and a dual G4 in addition
to their lowend CPU.
>
>How will they compare to PowerMac cards, like the PPC's on ZIF socket?
>
As I said, ZIF is dead - look inside a Mac, you won't find it there.
>
>IMHO: If we want to keep up with PPC developments, the CPU slot
>specification should be open to third parties.
>
Yes, why not! Anyone making dual-1GHz cards? :)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 35 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Lennart Fridén on 30-Jan-2002 10:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (Anonymous):
"Yes, why not! Anyone making dual-1GHz cards? :)"
For the Amiga market? Sure, let me just get my soldering irons warmed up first...:-)
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 36 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 30-Jan-2002 19:29 GMT
In reply to Comment 35 (Lennart Fridén):
If the slot would be open, there might be other interested parties, for PPC Linux + AmigaOS + MorphOS market.
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 37 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 31-Jan-2002 13:53 GMT
www.barefeats.com :
01/30/02 -- Performance numbers are begining to trickle in from readers who purchased Dual 1GHz Power Macs. Compared to the Dual 800, it is an average of 25% faster running Quake 3, CineBench and AltiVec Fractal... which is what you would expect with a 25% faster clock speed. Even more interesting is the fact that the GeForce3 is 25% faster than the GeForce4 MX (1024 x 768 x 32 bit).
Motorola Ships First 1 GHz Processor Implementing the PowerPC Instruction Set Architecture : Comment 38 of 38ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 31-Jan-2002 15:01 GMT
In reply to Comment 37 (priest):
>Even more interesting is the fact that the GeForce3 is 25% faster than the
>GeForce4 MX (1024 x 768 x 32 bit).
>
Obviously this is where they cut the price...
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