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[News] Hyperion chat log availableANN.lu
Posted on 19-Feb-2002 15:22 GMT by Teemu I. Yliselä63 comments
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The log from yesterday's IRC chat with Hyperion has been posted on the AUG99 homepage here.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 1 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Rik Sweeney on 19-Feb-2002 15:54 GMT
Very interesting read. I feel sorry for Hyperion though for having to answer the same questions over and over and over and over and over...
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 2 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Graham on 19-Feb-2002 16:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (Rik Sweeney):
It appears that the chat was 3.5 hours long, so people wouldn't have been present for the earlier answers.
But very interesting and informative overall. Maybe someone could distill it into a FAQ?
Graham
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 3 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 19-Feb-2002 17:05 GMT
HOT DAMN that was a long read!!
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 4 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Budda on 19-Feb-2002 19:04 GMT
Blimey, what a long read.
Would be nice if somebody could summarise it.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 5 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 19-Feb-2002 19:20 GMT
So the current delay for OS 4.0 is thought to be nine months (150%), giving us a delivery date of March / April? Well I suppose that's something for the hard core to look forward to...
The AmigaOne schedule is still an unknown quantity though. On 27th June 2001 the project was supposedly on track to deliver boards to dealers "1st week October". This would imply that at that time 3--4 months of work remained to be done.
We will assume that the 27th June update was not a lie, but simply omitted to tell Amigans that in fact all work had been stalled for over a month.
Eyetech announced the new agreement in November, saying the work would (re)start immediately. According to their original timetable that would mean AmigaOne boards are now being manufactured and will be distributed in a couple of weeks time.
Since it's already a year late (200% overrun) and there's no sign that it is being manufactured this could mean that AmigaOne will be cancelled. The Hyperion comments seem to hint at that by saying that AmigaOne doesn't refer to a computer but rather an idea or type of machine.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 6 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 19-Feb-2002 19:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 5 (Anonymous):
>Since it's already a year late (200% overrun) and there's no sign that it is >being manufactured this could mean that AmigaOne will be cancelled. The >Hyperion comments seem to hint at that by saying that AmigaOne doesn't refer >to a computer but rather an idea or type of machine.
Yes it's very late, but Hyperion's comment was just echoing what Amiga Inc has said all alone. An 'AmigaOne' is any computer that conforms to the Zico specs. Eyetech just happens to call their product an AmigaOne1200. Someone could make a computer based on a Pegasos MB and call it a AmigaOne-P or whatever. i wouldn't read into that as a comment against Elbox's very late product.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 7 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by cOrpse on 19-Feb-2002 20:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 5 (Anonymous):
And the date for your non Troll brain is over due by <insert age here> years.
There was a great "inside chat about Hyperion and its groupies" going on on the same server full of trolls like u!! They had nothing on hyperion just lame excusses y they were wrong , my fav was hyperion has only ever done games , so this means their stuck to games ? Wrong , linux started life as a terminal emulator( and was going to be called freaks lol) have a look now.
Rebuilding OS 3.1 on ppc wouldn`t take long at all, but hyperion are planning progression after all ;) something people like you wouldn`t know about.
P.s. How come everyone against Aos4 etc loves the WB3.1 look ??! lol
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 8 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by coldfire on 19-Feb-2002 21:31 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Graham):
What I liked was the way they just blew amithlon off. It was like..yeah that's nice, but we're making an OS. hehe
I really liked what they said about X86...right on the mark. Trying to compete on X86 is just death.
coldfire
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 9 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by John Block on 19-Feb-2002 22:14 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Anonymous):
Wonder if there will be an exam and degree awarded after all these
years of study.
Zico is the specification, AmigaOne is awarded to machines where
Amiga has had information shared and has approved the machine.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 10 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by smithy on 20-Feb-2002 00:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 8 (coldfire):
>I really liked what they said about X86...right on the mark. Trying to compete
>on X86 is just death.
But they never said why.... they never do say why.
BTW, Sun haven't abandoned x86, like it was stated a number of times in that log - quite the opposite in fact.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 11 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by KenH on 20-Feb-2002 00:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (smithy):
How childish is this argument?
Let them (with limited resources) get a half decent OS out for one platform first and then maybe you might have a case. Even then, the content/market/drivers of the OS would have to be massive to even comtemplate a task like porting to x86.
But then I'm just here typing on a keyboard, so what the hell do I know.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 12 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 20-Feb-2002 00:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (smithy):
They don't have to say why.It's their(and/or Amiga Inc's)choice.It
might change in the future,or it might not.No amount of Amithlon/AmigaXL
users(or people who have a pc as well as an Amiga)complaining about no x86
version of OS4 will change their minds.
'strange comparison follows...:)'
It's almost like Playstation1 owners complaining that they can't use
Playstation2 games on their console.Tuff.Want to run something that your
hardware doesn't support?Then you're going to have to buy some new hardware
to run it then,aren't you???...
See,told you it was an odd comparison.
Respect their decisions/choices,whether you agree with them or not.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 13 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 20-Feb-2002 01:01 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (smithy):
I don't want to flame, but why post something that is entirely untrue?
Sun to drop Intel support in Solaris 9
http://www.linuxworld.com.au/news.php3?nid=1168&tid=4
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 14 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Mike Veroukis on 20-Feb-2002 01:02 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (Alan Watson):
>No amount of Amithlon/AmigaXL users(or people who have a pc as well as an Amiga
>complaining about no x86 version of OS4 will change their minds.
Well, you definetly don't have a future in marketing. I think there is an amount of people that should influence anyone's opinion in this matter. If there were a million users out there demaninding an x86 version of OS4, you'd be a fool to ignore them. I'm not saying there is a million x86er's out there, but your comment makes it seem like come hell or high water you you're gonna build a PPC OS just because. Real smart.
- Mike
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 15 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 20-Feb-2002 01:53 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Mike Veroukis):
>>Well, you definetly don't have a future in marketing.
I'm glad you said that,I hate marketing types...
>If there were a million users out there demaninding an x86 version of OS4,
>you'd be a fool to ignore them. I'm not saying there is a million x86er's
>out there, but your comment makes it seem like come hell or high water
>you're gonna build a PPC OS just because. Real smart.
I never said that it was smart,it's just my opinion,stupid as it may be:)On
the x86 OS4 issue,all I could see happening is somebody would write a
wrapper that sits on top of x86 OS4 and lets you run Windoze apps.From
Hyperions,and I'd guess quite a few other software developers,this would be
their worst nightmare(wonder why....)
I honestly can't see x86 Windoze users buying an x86 OS4,unless they already
own an Amiga and a PC,and don't fancy upgrading their Amiga again because of
the cost of the hardware to run OS4 PPC.I just can't see x86 owners who
already run Windoze being tempted by OS4,since none of the apps they use on
a daily basis are available for it.After all,why have some Amiga owners
bought pc's?I'd guess it's because they need/have to use certain apps for
their courses/jobs that run on x86,and would never appear on a 68xxx or PPC
based Amigas.Nowadays,an OS will never survive unless it has some
major/must-have applications(and games)running on it(unless it's free).At
this point in time,OS4 doesn't have this.It's just keeping the existing user
base alive,which we should be grateful for,until hopefully the above
software situation changes....
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 16 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Watson on 20-Feb-2002 01:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Alan Watson):
Sorry,this :
'From Hyperions,and I'd guess quite a few other software developers,'
should have been :
'From Hyperions,and I'd guess quite a few other software developers point
of view,'
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 17 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by mark on 20-Feb-2002 02:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Alan Watson):
>I honestly can't see x86 Windoze users buying an x86 OS4,unless they already
>own an Amiga and a PC,and don't fancy upgrading their Amiga again because of
>the cost of the hardware to run OS4 PPC.I just can't see x86 owners who
>already run Windoze being tempted by OS4
And I can't see x86 users going out and buying an entirely new PPC machine either.
However, some ppl who have or had an interest in AmigaOS may find an x86 route more preferable to a PPC machine, either because they already have a PC, or they can get hold of one more cheaply.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 18 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Nian on 20-Feb-2002 03:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (mark):
Ok here go to lamers.
Lets think first before we comment on x86 systems.
The fact of the matter is that if an amiga user was given a choice between
$1400AU for a kick ass 1.7Ghz AMD system or $2500 for an AmigaPPC G4 500Mhz system, when both systems have the same 68k compatibility, I hate to say it
but only a fool would buy the AmigaPPC.
Honestly there isn't that much must have PPC software, most of the software
for PPC is merely a rewritten 68k app for speed. No more features just speed,
so PPC atmo isn't worth it when a PC emulating the 68k runs faster than the PPC.
Also if someone is willing to spend $300AU for AmigaXl/Amithlon then surely
they are willing to spend $300 for OS4 x86. To me I have my Classic Amiga4000
for custom chip support, but for raw power and modern hardware give me a PC system running AmigaOS anyday. Oh and if I spend that $1400 for the Athlon1700 with 512mb ddr a 60gb HD and the Geforce2.... Oh and the $300 for amigaos for it then I am still saving $800AU compaired to an amigappc and I get a twice as good a system to boot.
No PPC is far too expensive isn't fast enough and can't compete with a x86 compatible. Not to mention the ability to upgrade so easily and to know that the potential amiga user base can excede the limmited production run of that shitty AmigaONE. Oh and if AmigaOS was for the PC then anyone in the world could buy it off the shelf, but who will sell AmigaOS when they have to stock hard to get expensive low spec PPC Systems.
One last thing. If Titan, Hyperion, Haage&Partner are worried about serious competition with PC software then perhaps they should develop software that
is on par with today standards instead of producing out of date crap.
For F*** sakes some of the games released in the last 2 years would have been laughted at in 92.
They suck, you suck, and good night.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 19 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 20-Feb-2002 05:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Nian):
*cough* AROS *cough*
Seriously, we have this open source project with some really good things going for it. Why are there so few interrested in helping out developing it?
/Björn
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 20 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 20-Feb-2002 06:37 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Nian):
Ok, then I'm a fool and a proud one. ;)
If one likes Amiga and is ready to but the money where one's mouth is, PPC is the way to go, 68k is a dead end. Amigas and Macs will remain more expensive than x86 boxes, better accept that and learn to live with it.
I choose G4 machine anyday over my sucking AMD box. I've wasted too much money for x86 HW already, time to have something high quality (or at least fun) to invest on...
Nian, you should have read the IRC log.
>The fact of the matter is that if an amiga user was given a choice between $1400AU for a kick ass 1.7Ghz AMD system or
>$2500 for an AmigaPPC G4 500Mhz system, when both systems have the same 68k compatibility, I hate to say it but only
>a fool would buy the AmigaPPC.
There is life beyond 68k. AmigaOS is going via the PPC route. Take it or leave it. We will know the price of those four AmigaPPC systems when they are available.
>Honestly there isn't that much must have PPC software, most of the software
>for PPC is merely a rewritten 68k app for speed. No more features just speed,
But FYI, that's just what CPU's deliver. Speed/calculation power. No features.
>so PPC atmo isn't worth it when a PC emulating the 68k runs faster than the PPC.
Not true. See http://www.barefeats.com/pentium4.html
You are lying to yourself if you think that emulated 68k can ever beat modern PPC. Also there is faster 68k JIT emulation for PPC than for x86 (not H&P emu, though).
>... Oh and the $300 for amigaos for it then I am still saving $800AU compaired to an amigappc and I get a twice as good a system to boot.
That's just YOUR opinnion, IMO: you wasted your $1700 on the Athlon. ;)
>No PPC is far too expensive isn't fast enough and can't compete with a x86 compatible.
I've prepared to pay more if I get what I want.
PPC is not fast enough? How come? Not fast enough for what? We are talking about Amiga, I remind you.
IMO: Amigas do not compete with x86 compatibles.
>Not to mention the ability to upgrade so easily
I do not want to replase the motherboard every now and then... and re-install everything again ... and try to find all the needed patches for that motherboard all over again... I rather just swap one card, like the CPU card.
>and to know that the potential amiga user base can excede the limmited production run of that shitty AmigaONE.
READ THE IRC LOG !
>Oh and if AmigaOS was for the PC then anyone in the world could buy it off the shelf,
Not true. Have you seen AmigaOSXL on the self of any PC store? I have not.
>One last thing. If Titan, Hyperion, Haage&Partner are worried about serious competition with PC software then perhaps they should develop software that is on par with today standards instead of producing out of date crap.
Sorry but you have lost your grip to reality.
>For F*** sakes some of the games released in the last 2 years would have been laughted at in 92.
What Titan/Hyperion/H&P game you are talking about?
>They suck, you suck, and good night.
Try the other way around. Perhaps there is only one that sucks..
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 21 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by cato hagen on 20-Feb-2002 08:04 GMT
>It will be possible to use more than 107 letters in the file names in the AmiFFS ? >Will it be better than PFS3 ?
>ThomasF 1: AFAIK, no. That's a limit of DOS.
AmigaOS have a DOS ? Can anyone explain to me why PFS3 can have 107 letters
in filename and bypass that 'DOS' limit and AmiFFS can't because of DOS limit ?
Is AmiFFS a MS-DOS port of FAT16 ?
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 22 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 20-Feb-2002 08:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 21 (cato hagen):
>>It will be possible to use more than 107 letters in the file names in the AmiFFS ? >Will it be better than PFS3 ?
Notice, "more than 107".
>>ThomasF 1: AFAIK, no. That's a limit of DOS.
> AmigaOS have a DOS ? Can anyone explain to me why PFS can have 107 letters
> inf filename and bypass that 'DOS' limit and AmiFFS can't because of DOS limit ?
Are you saying that 107 > 107?
From dos/dos.h:
struct FileInfoBlock {
...
char fib_FileName[108];
Go figure.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 23 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by smithy on 20-Feb-2002 08:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 13 (Anonymous):
>I don't want to flame, but why post something that is entirely untrue?
>
>Sun to drop Intel support in Solaris 9
>http://www.linuxworld.com.au/news.php3?nid=1168&tid=4
Solaris isn't going to be available on x86 any more. Does that mean Sun has abandoned x86 development? No. Solaris is a high-end server operating system, Sun have found that it wasn't doing too well on the low-end PC server market against Linux so they shelved Solaris/x86, and instead are developing their own Linux cheap x86 hardware only. Sun haven't abandoned x86 - the truth is the very opposite.
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t269-s2103954,00.html
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 24 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by McGreg on 20-Feb-2002 08:28 GMT
@nian:
"$2500 for an AmigaPPC G4 500Mhz"
What are you talking about ???
A Pegasos costs 1000euro with a G3-400Mhz -so a Pegasos with G4-500 would cost 2500$ ???????????? NEVER
For 2500$ you would get a POWER HELL-Pegasos with a least dual G4-1Ghz ...
Bye,
McGreg
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 25 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by smithy on 20-Feb-2002 08:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 11 (KenH):
>How childish is this argument?
It's not an argument, it's a question. One which they seem incapable of answering.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 26 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by smithy on 20-Feb-2002 08:34 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Mike Veroukis):
>If there were a million users out there demaninding an x86 version of OS4,
>you'd be a fool to ignore them. I'm not saying there is a million x86er's out
>there, but your comment makes it seem like come hell or high water you you're
>gonna build a PPC OS just because. Real smart.
You're right Mike, they seem determined to build a PPC OS regardless of the market. This comes from the IRC log:
>bastiw : 9) how much customers do you think there are? 3?
>Hans-JoergF : 9 dunno
Perhaps that's why they can't justify their PPC-only decision. Because they just 'dunno'.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 27 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 20-Feb-2002 08:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 24 (McGreg):
I think that figure was in Australian dollars.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 28 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Solar on 20-Feb-2002 08:48 GMT
In reply to Comment 24 (McGreg):
> A Pegasos costs 1000euro with a G3-400Mhz -so a Pegasos with G4-500
> would cost 2500$ ???????????? NEVER
Correct me if I am wrong, but does that Pegasos 1000€ price tag include gfx card, sound card, case, power unit, keyboard, mouse, and monitor? AFAIR, no.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 29 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 20-Feb-2002 09:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (Solar):
>Correct me if I am wrong, but does that Pegasos 1000€ price tag include
I think the motherboard + 400Mhz G3 costs 650 euros.
>gfx card,
Costs about 100€
>sound card,
There's integrated audio.
>case,power unit,
50€
>keyboard,
20€
>mouse,
10€ ?
> and monitor?
170€
hard disk 100€
That's just a little over 1000€.
>AFAIR, no.
I think yes. And I think you should be able to reach about the same price figure
with AmigaOne1200 (when excluding the A1200 motherboard & custom case).
No one knows the price of those other AmigaOne machines... not before they are in production.
About the x86 theme:
Be Inc sues M$...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/7/24134.html
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 30 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Hermans/Hyperion on 20-Feb-2002 09:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (Solar):
All this whining about price differentials between PPC and x86 hardware should be limited to the cost of the mobo.
Or do you think off the shelf IDE devices and AGP graphics cards which you can get from any PC dealer will be more expensive in the Amiga market?
Besides, I'll say it again, Apple is doing fine selling very expensive proprietary hardware, in fact they sell 4 million units every year.
If Harald & Co want to do OS 4 for x86, they should approach Amiga Inc. about this to get a license and do it themselves.
We're not going to do it and no amount of whining and insulting is going to change our minds.
A nice upfront payment of say 100K USD might change my mind but that's where it ends.
As Harald Frank is predicting a huge userbase of several hunderd thousand users of OS 4 x86, I'm sure he will be willing to raise that money.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 31 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by John Block on 20-Feb-2002 10:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (Alan Watson):
The fastest way to kill a bad product is great marketing.
Another point is that there are slick don't know nothing bullshitters,
and earnest dedicated people who want to keep factories in action and
and people in their jobs.
Unfortunatly you are right, the good people are being forced out of
the marketing business :(
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 32 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by John Block on 20-Feb-2002 10:34 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Mike Veroukis):
People love the concept of something, but whaen asked to pay, their
reaction can be totally different.
In any case the idea is to make the os platform independent, and in
amiga time, comaparable to geological time, it's soon.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 33 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by CD32Freak on 20-Feb-2002 10:46 GMT
"My name is Maximus Fatterus Agnusius, Commander of the Armies of the North and General of the Amiga Legions. Loyal servant to the true emperor, Jay Minerelius...mother to murdered daughters, wife to a murdered husband and I will have my vengence, in this life or the next."
Amiga Gladiator
:D
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 34 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by PPC or whatever on 20-Feb-2002 11:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Nian):
From my point of view the "true amiga spirit" is not to run emulations
of an old 68k on X86, but to own and use a independent system resembling
elegance, simplicity and intelligence. Instead of bloat, complexity,
unreliability and Redmond-dependance.
So X86 is not a choice, unless one's "spirit" is dead.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 35 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Nian on 20-Feb-2002 11:51 GMT
In reply to Comment 29 (priest):
Hrm interesting, you racked up 450euro and forgot to add the 256mb DDR Memory, CDRom Drive, Not to mention that you under priced the Mouse and KB, remember I was talking good equipment such as the Optical MM Microsoft Mouse and MM KB. Anyway even with your low bull shit price lets see how it converts to AU$'s
450euro$760AU
Now 650euro for the likely price of the AmigaONE$1100AU
Ok $760 + $1100$1860. But hey lets try australian dollars for each system and forget your lame Euro ready? Ok here we go.
AmigaONE $1100
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 36 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Nian on 20-Feb-2002 12:03 GMT
Sorry the post got cut off for some reason, anyway the problem I find is that the current hight end G4 costs a hell of allot and we don't have a price for the AmigaONE. Also the PC I quoted had DDR memory and the AmigaOne can only use old SDRam PC100.
The next biggest problem is support, if you buy an AmigaOne then how long will that system have continued support? Will these companies die like Phase5? What about repairs? For the PC if there was AmigaOS on them you wouldn't have to worry about hardware problems other than driver support, software development has always been the amigas greatest strength. Lets forget the hardware side, stop buying out of date gear and make the amigaos as good as it was meant to be.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 37 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 20-Feb-2002 12:08 GMT
I have a question to Hyperion and their partners working on OS4.0. What easter eggs will be in the OS? Maybe..
1)By P96 team: We made it and Elbox screwed it up.
2)By Hyperion: Ralph Schmidt couldn't code his way out of a paper bag.
3)By H&P: We could have done a better job without Hyperion.
I guess we will have to wait and see unless someone wants to blurt out early;-)
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 38 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 20-Feb-2002 12:31 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (Solar):
>Correct me if I am wrong, but does that Pegasos 1000€ price tag include gfx >card, sound card, case, power unit, keyboard, mouse, and monitor? AFAIR, no.
Is there really a huge price difference between a FAST PC mobo + CPU + Amithlon and a pegasos (that already include the native PPC OS) ?
If I understand well you can not afford this difference ?
I rather think you already spend a lot of money on your PC.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 39 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 20-Feb-2002 13:07 GMT
In reply to Comment 35 (Nian):
Actually, I just put prices to the components you were demanding + the hard disk. But yes, I forgot RAM.
Amigas will use SDRAM (100 and 133 for AmigaOne1200, 133 for pegasos), I just bought 256Mb for less than 100euros.
Still, if the motherboard and CPU cost 650euros, I think full (decent) system should not cost much past 1000euros...
Sorry but I concentrate on euros, it's usable around here. ;-)
Also about the CPU I think most of us do not really "need" 1Ghz G4, even low end G4's are enough for all current Amiga apps as well as for all apps coming in the foreseeable future (like for Realsoft3D). For Amithlon you will need at least 2 to 4 times more Mhz to reach the same result than with native PPC system.
About support: IMO x86 motherboard support sucks, sorry but it does, at least in my case, I've spend several days in hunting the information needed to get the new motherboard fully working state. After half year of fighting with your new motherboard, the motherboard manufacturer starts to loose interest in supporting because they got two new revisions allready... And remember that for the AmigaOSx86, you would anyway need to write support separately for the used motherboard. Things are not as simple as they sometimes seem to be. I think majority of the community prefer going for the PPC, but the unsatisfied part is more vocal, as usual.
IMHO: It would be like asking for death if AmigaOS only route would go to x86. It is mandatory to have at least one niche/custom supported system. After we have HAL and new custom HW, it might be a good idea to let someone port OS4 ALSO to x86.
My personal taste prefers PPC, PPC is a very nice CPU, perhaps the most advanced CPU (even though not the fastest in every aspect), so I'm very happy that Hyperion supports PPC.
BTW. I would like to hear David Haynie's comment on this. But I bet he does not want to get involved in this silly issue.
Ok, these were just my opinnions ... C U.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 40 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by David Scheibler on 20-Feb-2002 13:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (Solar):
>Correct me if I am wrong, but does that Pegasos 1000€ price tag include gfx >card, sound card, case, power unit, keyboard, mouse, and monitor?
It does include all of the above (also dvd rom) except the monitor.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 41 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 20-Feb-2002 13:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 26 (smithy):
">bastiw : 9) how much customers do you think there are? 3?
>Hans-JoergF : 9 dunno
Perhaps that's why they can't justify their PPC-only decision. Because
they just 'dunno'."
So how many copies of OS 4 do people think they will sell ?
My guess would be around 1100.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 42 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Andrea on 20-Feb-2002 13:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (Solar):
As stated more than once, bPlan are trying to market a Pegasos with G3@400MHz, AGP gfx board, keyboard and mouse, memoty, DVD and HD at about 1000Euro, ~900USD. Monitor not included, audio, 56kbps modem, ethernet, USB and Firewire on board. This price is almost competitive with PCs.
Kind regards,
Andrea
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 43 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 20-Feb-2002 13:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (PPC or whatever):
There is absolutely nothing from Microsoft in an Amithlon computer,
except the web fonts.
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 44 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by green cup on 20-Feb-2002 13:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (mark):
BTW: Maybe there could be a step together from both sides
(Amithlon & PPC): OS4 should support a PPC-PCI plugin card in
the x86 machine. So you get a real OS4-PPC running and don't have
to invest to a full A-One machine. This should be possible for
e.g. a SharkPPC (like) board...
So, Amithlon and OS4/PPC users could both have a live in the
OS4 era then...hopefully, but I guess I am just dreaming
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 45 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by David Scheibler on 20-Feb-2002 13:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 41 (Don Cox):
>So how many copies of OS 4 do people think they will sell ?
>My guess would be around 1100.
Don't forget the party pack buyers that will get OS4.0 and OS4.2 for free.
(party pack is now available for around 130eur, so OS4.0+OS4.2 shouldn't be more expensive...).
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 46 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by Jules on 20-Feb-2002 16:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 26 (smithy):
> Perhaps that's why they can't justify their PPC-only decision. Because they just 'dunno'.
Perhaps the 'justification' is that they only have a license to port the OS to the PPC. They said on more than one occasion that they do not have a license to port to x86
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 47 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by AnonX on 20-Feb-2002 21:11 GMT
Could someone upload the UNEDITED LOG! and post a link to it pls some relevant questions were left out while the hyperion guys were answering
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 48 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by NeRP on 20-Feb-2002 22:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 33 (CD32Freak):
LOL!!
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 49 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by coldfire on 20-Feb-2002 22:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (smithy):
Actually they do say why there is no port to X86...because it can't hope to compete in windoze's back yard.
And SUN did drop X86 development for Solaris. They continue to support current work but are not developing
more.
coldfire
Hyperion chat log available : Comment 50 of 63ANN.lu
Posted by NeRP on 20-Feb-2002 22:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Nian):
Alright, you are saying it's cheaper for YOU to have x86 AmigaOS cause
then you wouldn't have to buy 'expensive' PPC hardware.
Well fuckoff.
I don't own PC or PPC. I'd rather spend MY money on a PPC MB and let
the amiga have dignity as it's own platform rather than end up as a
stupid windows add on. Not my fault you bought the PC, and it
shouldn't be Hyperions either.
The rest of your post isn't worth responding to.
Anonymous, there are 63 items in your selection [1 - 50] [51 - 63]
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