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[News] Amiga Inc. April executive updateANN.lu
Posted on 13-Apr-2002 12:49 GMT by Teemu I. Yliselä186 comments
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The update, dated 12th April, can be found here.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 1 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Teemu I. Yliselä on 13-Apr-2002 10:49 GMT
For those who want the direct link...
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 2 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Jørn Rune Jakobsen on 13-Apr-2002 10:57 GMT
No mention of Pegasos here.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 3 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 11:06 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (Jørn Rune Jakobsen):
No mention of supporting the Mac either, Shawn will be dissapointed :-D
I guess what they are saying is that Pegasos - when it gets to the state where BPlan are happy with it - will be one of the first to go through the certification exercise /if/ they want it to run AOS4.
Really I would prefer to run AmigaOS4 on my quad PPC processor RS/6000 which makes the current crop of x86 single CPU systems look like toys. But Ive already stumped up the cash for an A1 developer board. Why? Because Im a developer.
Am I sad that my RS6k will never be able to run AOS4? No. Because the AmigaOS is a toy hobby operating system and I have real work to do to pay for me to keep writing cool software for that toy hobby operating system. ;-)
Dave.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 4 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 12:06 GMT
"For hardware which is not capable of being used in conjunction with Amiga WB 3.1 (such as the AmigaOne) we will require, as part of the licence conditions, that a copy of Amiga OS is purchased with all boards sold that are capable of running it."
Uhm?
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 5 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 12:23 GMT
Before this thread explodes too, I should prevent misunderstandings and post
this little quote from amiga.org once again:
[From Alan, Eyetech:]
"Yes, you will be able to buy a linux-only (actually non Amiga OS) board, and
subsequently buy the OS4+ROM upgrade package. The upgraded ROM will still have
all its open firmware code intact so you will still be able to run Linux etc"
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 6 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Keith Blakemore-Noble on 13-Apr-2002 12:26 GMT
In reply to Comment 4 (Björn Hagström):
What this means is that for ANY hardware capable of running AmigaOS4 or greater, AInc are demanding that it MUST be sold with a copy of AmigaOS *regardless of whether the person buying the hardware wants to run AmigaOS*.
I.e. they are proposing an Amiga Tax on all hardware which is capable of running AmigaOS - just like the much critisised "Microsoft Tax" where PCs were sold with Windows whether you wanted it or not.
Sad to see AInc are stooping to such low tactics (and don't give me any "anti piracy" bullshit - there are plenty of other ways to reduce piracy without FORCING people to pay for an OS if they do not want it), but then given they are working more and more with Microsoft these days, it is hardly surprising that some of MS's dodgy tactics are rubbing of on AInc.
A sad day indeed :-(
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 7 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 12:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
Reading a bit more it seems as if they are saying that all machines with the AOS4 Rom code must be sold with AOS4 since they can run it. Boards sold without the AOS rom code cannot run AOS4 and thus can be sold without AOS4.
Nothing wierd about it.
<guessing>
And if you want to run AOS4 later you'd have to get an AOS4 ROM upgrade and the AOS4 package.
</guessing>
It all seems fair to me.
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 8 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 13-Apr-2002 12:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (Björn Hagström):
There is NO AOS4 ROM.
There are "extensions" in the board's boot ROM, but that is not an AOS4 ROM by any stretch of the imagination.
Economies of scale being what they are, it will be cheaper to have ONE boot ROM for a product as opposed to different ones depending upon whether you may or may not want to run AOS, so systems will end up with the ROM which offers most flexibility (i.e. with the AOS "extensions" so you can run AOS if you choose, but you can also run other OSes if you choose), resulting in those systems being subject to AInc's Amiga Tax.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 9 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 13-Apr-2002 12:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (Björn Hagström):
There is NO AOS4 ROM.
There are "extensions" in the board's boot ROM, but that is not an AOS4 ROM by any stretch of the imagination.
Economies of scale being what they are, it will be cheaper to have ONE boot ROM for a product as opposed to different ones depending upon whether you may or may not want to run AOS, so systems will end up with the ROM which offers most flexibility (i.e. with the AOS "extensions" so you can run AOS if you choose, but you can also run other OSes if you choose), resulting in those systems being subject to AInc's Amiga Tax.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 10 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 12:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
Didn't I just post quote Alan Redhouse's quote in #5 just to avoid misinterpretations
like this?
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 11 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Keith Blakemore-Noble on 13-Apr-2002 12:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (Anonymous):
Doh!
Sorry abot the double-posting AND for not adding my name. Double-doh!
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 12 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Gregory Hayes on 13-Apr-2002 12:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (Björn Hagström):
It'll probably take a week and a half for someone to release a workaround for non-compliant boards anyway.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 13 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Tialaramex on 13-Apr-2002 12:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
No, it's the other way around. This is closer to the behaviour of Apple. They can't afford to actually develop software at market prices, and they refuse to compete on a level playing field, so their OS requires specialist hardware even though it has no need to. How Hyperion (who would presumably be happy to sell as many copies of AOS 4.0 as they can) fit into this is harder to see, maybe they view this as an anti-piracy measure.
As far as I understand it this is no different from the A1200 era Amigas, you couldn't run Linux or BSD on them back then, so C= could tie the hardware to the operating system without anyone throwing a fit.
The good news here is that cheaper non-Amiga PPC boards will be available from Eyetech for the vast majority of PPC users who don't want to run AmigaOS but do appreciate a new PPC motherboard. Hopefully Eyetech didn't have to fight too hard for that.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 14 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 13:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 11 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
On ANN you always gets replies like this by some smartass. I did not mean a ROM as is the AOS 3.1 roms. If something seems wierd, first think "Is this person trying to say something improbable or something probable." Apply that to everything you read and always asume the latter, your life will be so much much easier to live.
People like you make it impossible to discuss something without explaining every little detail into minusculde detail without geting smartass comments that has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion is the first place.
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 15 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 13:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (Gregory Hayes):
Probably.
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 16 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by acg on 13-Apr-2002 13:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
Your viewpoint is a possibility.
But consider that another aspect of that decision is to make sure
that no consumer buys a board that is not able to run the OS.
Could you imagine a vendor or designer of boards saying that his
board can run AOS4, and when you finally boot it up, it turns out
that there are bugs in the board that doesn't allow you to
run AOS4? You would have wasted money twice, once on a board
that can't run AOS4, and another time on an OS that cannot run
on the board.
I think the policy is based on getting a reliable useful product
into the hands of its users, but there is a definite bonus in that
you get to sell your OS also.(bonus to the sellers that is).
On, the other hand, since there is so much piracy, Amiga probably
figures that most of the "community" is capable of stealing the OS
anyway, and will probably do so. Their argument might be that
the inflated cost of ALL software is due to the fact that so much
of software is pirated, that the extra cost is tacked on to
compensate....so it's not too bad of a deal to make sure they
can recoup their costs....
Overall, the policy is a "wash", it is good for quality assurance,
and bad for extra cost.....and even though Microsoft has made money
probably illegally exploiting its monopoly, that doesn't mean
that other companies cannot make money legally.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 17 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Keith Blakemore-Noble on 13-Apr-2002 14:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Björn Hagström):
Bjorn - I note that you seem to be losing yourself in pedantic discourse and personal insult, rather than addressing the ACTUALY issue at hand.
Perhaps you ought to apply to yourself the techniques which you are lecturing me upon - did it ever occur to you that me interpreting your reference to "OS4 ROMs" as meaning OS4 ROMs (a la KS3.1 et al) rather than "boot ROMs with OS4 'extensins'" was simply because that was how it appeared to be written by you? Did it ever ocur to you that this was not some giant conspiracy to piss you off, wind you up and send you into a frenzy?
Now, if you have finished ranting, let's return to the discussion itself.
I have postulated that whilst it is a possibility that manufacturers may be content to have multiple different versions of their boot ROM, economies of scale et al woudl seem to suggest that they will instead settle for a single version of the boot ROM, and thus open up the possibility that units sold will be subject to Amiga Tax even though they may well be purchased by people with no intention of running AmigaOS (e.g. those seeking a low-cost LinuxPPC board).
That was, I believe, where we left off before you started ranting. If you woudl turn your attention to the topic, then perhaps we can return to a meaningful debate.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 18 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Darrin on 13-Apr-2002 14:03 GMT
Why was this "news" posted again? If you look 2 posts down it's there under "unmoderated". The moderators were quick to delete any posts which they felt were not worthy of ANN, but feel free to repost other news items within 12 hours of the original just so they can put their names at the top.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 19 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Keith Blakemore-noble on 13-Apr-2002 14:08 GMT
In reply to Comment 16 (acg):
I have absolutely no problems with AInc having a licensing mechanism so that customers can be reassured that if a system says it is Amiga-compatible then it IS Amiga-compatible and will run the OS.
Indeed, I strongly support such an approach!
What I DO have a problem with is the way in which AInc is using this as a way of sneaking in their Amiga Tax but insisting that EVERY system capable of running AOS4 *MUST* be sold with a copy of AOS4, regardless of whether the customer WANTS AOS 4 or not.
Akin to Microsoft's insistance that shops sell PCs with a copy of Windows, whether the customer wants Windows or not.
They try to justify this in the name of "anti-piracy" and ensuring that customers don't find their computer won't run AmigaOS when they thought it would, but the fact remains it is a nasty underhanded Amiga Tax, pure and simple. there is absolutely NO justification for demanding that AOS is sold with systems just because they can run it - there are plenty of ways of ensuring that only liensed copies of the OS are run which do NOT require everyone to pay AInc for software even if they don't have the slightest intention oif ever using it.
THAT is where my objection lies. The licensing of systems itself is a damned good idea; the imposition of Amiga Tax is a damned BAD idea.
All imho, naturally.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 20 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 14:09 GMT
"pom·pous Pronunciation Key (pmps)
adj.
Characterized by excessive self-esteem or exaggerated dignity; pretentious: pompous officials who enjoy giving orders.
Full of high-sounding phrases; bombastic: a pompous proclamation.
Chracterized by pomp or stately display; ceremonious: a pompous occasion."
Nuff said.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 21 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 14:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
I'm sending a reply to this in a private email. I'm fed up with pointless flamewars on Amiga forums and I have no intention of making one here with you.
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 22 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 14:26 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Keith Blakemore-noble):
Keith
I cant claim to have read as much into the announcement as you clearly have but even if what you say is true there is nothing stopping companies shipping PPC boards at the Zico level with AmigaOS4 bootstrapping ( or whatever the damn technology is ) is there?
It is almost analagous to NewTek when I had to buy a Toaster just to get my hands on LightWave all those years ago. I didnt mind the tax because the Toaster just happened to be a nice bit of kit.
No. Bad analogy.
I guess what Im saying is I dont see the Microsoft like motives there. I see a hardware key that *must* be shipped with a copy of the software to prevent me cutting a duplicate of AOS4 CD and giving you it. They also dont have a Microsoft like monopoly position and it would be hard for them to abuse it.
We ask companies to be self regulating for quality, branding and certification is one very popular way to do this.
IMHO I dont see anything sinister here, if it slows down piracy then I dont blame them after all they are a company not a charity.
Dave
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 23 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 14:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 22 (DaveW):
That was supposed to be *without* bootstrapping.
Oh and well done Bjorn. :-)
Dave.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 24 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Alkemyst on 13-Apr-2002 14:29 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Keith Blakemore-noble):
golly there are some ppl who realy dont understand what was said
A PPC mobo will only be capable of running AOS4 when the flashrom has been updated with AmigaOS extentions
you seem to mist the post where eyetech will sell the ppcmobo with out the amigaOs extentions &
you will not have top pay for AmigaOs4 nore will eyetech have to pay Amiga.inc the fee
as it have not been flashed with AOS extentions.
if a ppc mobo maker flashed the ppcmobo with Macrom do you think that Apple would not want a fee for the Macrom
as the Macrom belongs to Apple.
& anyway if you then deside to run AmigaOs4 & up on it would can get the flash updated later.
that they own
any ppcmobo maker can sell version of there mobo with out & with AmigaOsrom ext.
only needing to pay the fee when they sell the mobo with AmigaOsrom.ext
& whats the point in someone buying the version of the mobo with AmigaOsRom.ext
if they didnt want to run AmigaOs on it, so it makes sence to sell AmigaOs with AmigaOsRom.ext version of the mobo.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 25 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 14:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Keith Blakemore-noble):
> What I DO have a problem with is the way in which AInc is using this as a way
> of sneaking in their Amiga Tax but insisting that EVERY system capable of
> running AOS4 *MUST* be sold with a copy of AOS4, regardless of whether the
> customer WANTS AOS 4 or not.
Soon I'm ready to give up. READ post #5 for Christ sakes! Why isn't anyone
listening to me?
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 26 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 13-Apr-2002 14:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (SlimJim):
> Didn't I just post quote Alan Redhouse's quote in #5 just to avoid
> misinterpretations like this?
No you didn't. You excluded the subject that Alan set: "Amiga One for Linux?"
I.e. he was talking about buying OS4 + ROM separately for Eyetech's Amiga One (since there doesn't seem to ever be any "Amiga Ones" from other distributors), and this has been promised before to the people buying the Teron CX / Inguard Phoenix / A1-G3SE "developer" boards. If *anyone* can buy OS4 + ROM, then the Exec. Update is incorrect.
I can't believe there were so many less intellectually gifted that boycotted Amiga Inc. for silly reasons like AA running on MS platforms, when they have justified reasons like this.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 27 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 14:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 25 (SlimJim):
>Soon I'm ready to give up. READ post #5 for Christ sakes! Why isn't anyone
>listening to me?
To some people AMiga Inc. HAS to be the devil. Even the truth can't penetrate the image they want to put on Amiga Inc. It's the only image they can see, anything else is ignored.
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 28 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 14:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 26 (Seehund):
@Seehund
McEwan said that OS4 had to ship together with boards "capable of running it".
In the AmigaONEG3-SE:s case (and I guess most new-generation boards), this
capability is linked to the contents of the Flash-ROM. If Eyetech ships a board
WITHOUT the AOS4-fixed contents in ROM, the board, by definition, *cannot* run
OS4.
Thus those boards CAN be sold as a Linux-only alternative, without AOS, which
is what Alan said. That is how I interpreted it anyway.
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 29 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 14:46 GMT
In reply to Comment 26 (Seehund):
Amazing how you can agree with other people with everything else they have ever said and then come across one thing that you dont agree with. Good, shows we are a long way away from 1984 and Macarthyism.
1. The AmigaONE is not a TeronCX.
2. Im sure there are plenty of systems out there capable of running AOS4 without any extra driver work once it gets running on Eyetechs kit. I cant see short of tank warfare how Amiga Inc will go up to IBM and say - you know those SP2s, DaveWs RS/6000 well if you dont immediately ship 6,000,000 copies of AmigaOS4 with them we are going to be nasty to you.
3. In business terms they are saying to Elbox, BPlan and the rest - if you want AOS4 running on your systems you are going to have to pay the testing costs. This is close to the way the OEM and vendor system works in the real business world.
4. We arent in the free love Linux zone.
A nice slightly juvenile summary but its saturday and the films that I wanted to watch have been cancelled in favour of a stupid golf match.
You see that mountain over there - theres a mole in it. Im just going to have a cup of tea now.
Dave.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 30 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 13-Apr-2002 14:50 GMT
In reply to Comment 28 (SlimJim):
SlimJim,
Quite correct. But the point is that unless you have one of the boards Eyetech are distributing, you can not buy AmigaOS separately.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 31 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 14:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 27 (Björn Hagström):
Ive forgotten what I was going to say now. Dont you just hate that?
Oh yes.
I have always made a point of reading Keiths posts, on csam here and elsewhere because he puts so much into it ( regardless of his sometime schoolmarm tone that I suffer from also ).
From the outside he has seemed to have grown increasingly bitter towards Amino over the last few years to the extent of being very very pro MorphOS/Bplan on occasion.
No bad thing but like all the rest of us Keith aint objective. So be fair. Doesnt mean the guy doesnt deserve respect even when hes in his alt.flame veteran mode.
Dave.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 32 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 13-Apr-2002 14:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (Seehund):
"Quite correct. But the point is that unless you have one of the boards Eyetech are distributing, you can not buy AmigaOS separately."
You are right, existing Amiga PPC owners won't be able to buy AOS4.
.. thinking ..
WAIT! That's not what the Executive update says!
;)
/Björn
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 33 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 14:58 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (Seehund):
Seehund. Thats not even true.
What is true is:
At the moment you cannot run AmigaOS4 on any PPC boards cos it doesnt exist.
Soon we will be able to use it on PhaseV hardware and A1 hardware.
Later on, IF they go through the branding/licensing programme it will be available on any other PPC hardware that pays the "Amiga tax" as Keith put it.
Big deal. Vote with your feet if you dont like it, thats what I do.
Dave.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 34 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Keith Blakemore-Noble on 13-Apr-2002 15:07 GMT
In reply to Comment 25 (SlimJim):
SlimJim, it seems that Hyperion disagree with you.
"It will not be possible to buy boards without OS 4." as Ben Hermans quite clearly states in http://www.ann.lu/comments2.cgi?show=1018663936&category=unmoderated&number=54 which does seem to support my fears at this point.
Others have already pointed out that the quote from Alan to which you refer is where he (it appears) is talking about people buying the "existing" non-AOS AmigaOne.
One thing is clear, though. AInc's Executive Update is raising more questions. It seems even some leading figures in the development of AOS and AmigaOne may be interpreting things differently, depending upon the quotes around here...
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 35 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Teemu I. Yliselä on 13-Apr-2002 15:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (Darrin):
I posted it again since the original posting lacked the link due to bad formatting, but I didn't want to delete the 50+ comments it already had. Only Christian has the ability to fix existing news items (which would have been a better solution, of course).
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 36 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Alkemyst on 13-Apr-2002 15:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (Seehund):
the reason why you can only buy from eyetech
is because none else makes OpenPPC mobos YET.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 37 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 15:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (Seehund):
@ Seehund
Well, that at least makes post #5 a good read for those saying that we won't
be able to get the hardware without AOS4.
On the different subject of a "separate AOS4 + ROM"... It DOES say that OS4
won't ship unless with licenced hardware. Perhaps there is some angle I'm
missing, so I'll trust Alan here, if he says the OS will be available separately
for his board.
After all, how else are those developer-board purchasers going to get AOS4.0
on their systems?
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 38 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Hermans/Hyperion on 13-Apr-2002 15:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Keith Blakemore-noble):
Let me first of all say that I think ANN needs a way to avoid to the same subject (annex comments) show up in both moderated and unmoderated categories.
Now for the facts (which I already posted on the other unmoderated thread).
1. The AmigaOne will ship with OS 4. It is an OEM model which allows us to cut down on piracy and hence secure further funding for continued development of the OS.
If you are buying the hardware, you are also buying the software at the same time just like when you bought your original Amiga, an Apple machine or most pre-build Wintel machines.
2. There is NO impediment to running Linux or BSD or what have you on the AmigaOne.
3. Eyetech may well decide (if there is sufficient demand) to produce the same hardware but target it towards Linux PPC users.
Such hardware will not be called "AmigaOne" and will not ship with OS 4.
In fact, such hardware cannot be called "AmigaOne" for legal reasons.
It does appear that you will be able to buy a "conversion kit" with a ROM and a copy of OS 4. This will be more expensive than the OEM version.
4. In the post Commodore era there have been companies operating in the market whose business practises were sub-standard and occassionally criminal.
No technical support, no after sales service including repair, cards sent in for repair vanished into the Bermuda triangle, no warranty, pre-order money collected supposedly into an escrow account disappeared etc.
To avoid this type of sub-standard business practises, Amiga is insisting on "vetting" both the actual hardware (quality) and the company producing it (support infrastructure, financial viability etc.) to ensure that this type of activity does not damage the Amiga brand and Amiga's public image.
Companies wishing to target the Amiga userbase must submit to this process which takes place on the basis of fair, objective and reasonable criteria (as required by competition law).
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 39 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 13-Apr-2002 15:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 29 (DaveW):
DaveW,
> Amazing how you can agree with other people with everything else they have ever
> said and then come across one thing that you dont agree with. Good, shows we are
> a long way away from 1984 and Macarthyism.
NO! NO! You must join a faction! You must find a cause! You must never, ever deviate from that cause! You must accept the dogmatic ideology in it's entirety! You must not miss an opportunity to start flamewars against anything you consider being different from something in your ideological package!
:)
> 1. The AmigaONE is not a TeronCX.
No it isn't. OK, in my comment I confused the pre-production boards shown in recent photos with the "developers'" boards people have ordered.
> 2. Im sure there are plenty of systems out there capable of running AOS4
> without any extra driver work once it gets running on Eyetechs kit. I cant
> see short of tank warfare how Amiga Inc will go up to IBM and say - you know
> those SP2s, DaveWs RS/6000 well if you dont immediately ship 6,000,000 copies
> of AmigaOS4 with them we are going to be nasty to you.
Thing is, we'll never see OS4 running on many other systems than the Ter^H^H^H Ing^H^H^H Amiga One with this bundling and "solution provider" licensing.
> 3. In business terms they are saying to Elbox, BPlan and the rest - if you
> want AOS4 running on your systems you are going to have to pay the testing
> costs. This is close to the way the OEM and vendor system works in the real
> business world.
And they're saying "bend over and shut up" to consumers who don't give a crap if there's a "Made for Amiga" sticker on their otherwise OS4 compatible hardware. "So, you only need to buy OS4 and a ROM for your shiny PPC board? Screw you, you can't buy that! You shall buy the hardware We tell you to buy."
> 4. We arent in the free love Linux zone.
Which is another place where this conduct will be spit upon. "Gee, thanks Amiga Inc! Amiga users won't help enlarging the PPC market and increase competition, so we'll also be stuck with the few expensive options we already have."
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 40 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Darrin on 13-Apr-2002 15:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 35 (Teemu I. Yliselä):
Fair enough - as you said, it would make life easier if you could edit the original text. What was bothering me is that we're starting to see the same old arguments again which have already been explained away in the previous posting... oh well, who's going to notice a few more "flames" anyway ;)
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 41 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 15:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
> SlimJim, it seems that Hyperion disagree with you.
May I please direct you to post #26 for my view. I can only assume Hyperion
refers to the boards capable to run OS4 in the first place?
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 42 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 15:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 39 (Seehund):
LOL!!! :-)
Dave.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 43 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 15:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 41 (SlimJim):
Oh, look at that, Ben stepped in and replied much better than I managed to do
(i.e. with substance instead of assumptions!):-)
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 44 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Hermans/Hyperion on 13-Apr-2002 15:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (Keith Blakemore-Noble):
I was wrong.
I thought somebody claimed that you would be able to buy the AmigaOne without OS 4.
This is legally impossible.
You can however buy the same hardware without OS 4 for say Linux PPC if there is sufficient demand for it.
This can't be called "AmigaOne" and frankly I doubt there will be a lot of GENUINE interest (the "here is the money" type interest) in that seeing as Linux x86 offers more possibilities than Linux PPC and then there's the price-point ofcourse.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 45 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 15:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 44 (Ben Hermans/Hyperion):
Isnt the intro to Wasted Dreams great?
;-)
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 46 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Hermans/Hyperion on 13-Apr-2002 15:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 45 (DaveW):
What, you mean the game?
BTW Dave, our offer to get your PPC card fixed still stands.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 47 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by SlimJim on 13-Apr-2002 15:29 GMT
In reply to Comment 44 (Ben Hermans/Hyperion):
It is dangerously easy to mix up 'AmigaONE' (the brand name) with the physical
machine. "If it cannot run AOS4 it cannot be called an AmigaONE" - Keeping this
phrase in mind (or Eyetech coming up with another name for eventual Linux boards)
will hopefully clear a lot of confusion.
.
SlimJim
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 48 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 13-Apr-2002 15:31 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (Ben Hermans/Hyperion):
Ben,
> It does appear that you will be able to buy a "conversion kit" with a ROM and a
> copy of OS 4. This will be more expensive than the OEM version.
Do you know if a separate OS4 + ROM will be available for purchase to *anyone*, i.e. also to non-Eyetech customers?
If that's true, the Executive Update needs to be... updated. If it's not true, anyone who couldn't care less if his hardware is licensed is screwed and OS4 just got its death sentence in regards to gaining market shares outside the few faithful.
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 49 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW on 13-Apr-2002 15:33 GMT
In reply to Comment 46 (Ben Hermans/Hyperion):
Thanks Ben. It seems OK with the ceramic washer in there at the mo. If it does it again this week I will definately take you up on that. Its my only means of developing and testing Wup software.
Yes the game. :-)
Amiga Inc. April executive update : Comment 50 of 186ANN.lu
Posted by David Scheibler on 13-Apr-2002 15:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (Ben Hermans/Hyperion):
>Eyetech may well decide (if there is sufficient demand) to produce the same >hardware but target it towards Linux PPC users.
>Such hardware will not be called "AmigaOne" and will not ship with OS 4.
So what about those who ordered the AmigaOne beta board? Will OS4 for AmigaOne
be ready in 3-5weeks?
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