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[Motd] Weekend away / Stricter moderation?ANN.lu
Posted on 25-Jun-2002 15:05 GMT by Christian Kemp94 comments
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I'm back from a track&field meeting in Tallinn (EST) - which is why there were no updates and no article moderation on ANN inbetween Friday and today.

Also, I'd like to emphasize a point that has recently arisen in the comments section: while I dislike the idea of strict moderation and removal of articles and comments, something needs to be done to stop a few people from turning any thread into a flamefest (and a bad one, at that), and ruin the visiting experience for everybody else. I will therefore adopt a slightly stricter moderation policy - starting with informal warnings, and pursuing other options if these do not yield positive results (Possibilities for this would be manual removal of comments, the possibility to filter anonymous posters or certain IP ranges, or have an ignore list. Alas, the last three would require a rewrite of the comments system and possibly the implementation of user accounts, which would be a massive task. And comments?)

Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 1 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 25-Jun-2002 13:09 GMT
I think you should do it (user accounts), I think you will find that some will
still flamefest, politicise and otherwise spread misinformation but at least they
will be aware that they will lose their account and potentially have their IP mask
or ISP provider banned.
This will not protect you from the drive by idiots but it will mean that repeat
offenders will not bother us so much.
An ignore table would be very nice so that I can add various other usernames to
my ignore list and I would not see their comments.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 2 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa (216.77.210.24) on 25-Jun-2002 13:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (DaveW):
I agree. I'm sorry it comes at the cost of alot of work:-(
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 3 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Chris Allen (192.158.61.61) on 25-Jun-2002 13:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (redrumloa):
Moderation is always difficult to uphold. One mans flame can be another mans reasonable comment. Discussions should be maintained with every user respecting anothers view without the need for suggesting it is incorrect. User accounts are a good idea as most merely read without taking part. Tough job. Someones got to do it though.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 4 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa (216.77.210.24) on 25-Jun-2002 13:34 GMT
In reply to Comment 3 (Chris Allen):
>Moderation is always difficult to uphold.
You got that right!
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 5 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by anon (80.135.80.121) on 25-Jun-2002 13:48 GMT
Chris, just handle it like amiga-news.de does it. Censor comments. Replace the original contents of the comment by a standard netiquette text, but keep the posters name in the thread. thats the best way to handle this i think.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 6 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 25-Jun-2002 14:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 3 (Chris Allen):
Hence why an ignore list will be useful.
Some abuse is clear and the site owners decision should be final, if you dont agree with
it tough. Thats the only way you can police a chat site.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 7 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by smithy (62.31.144.2) on 25-Jun-2002 14:14 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (DaveW):
>I think you should do it (user accounts), I think you will find that some will
>still flamefest, politicise and otherwise spread misinformation but at least
>they will be aware that they will lose their account and potentially have
>their IP mask or ISP provider banned.
What's to stop a troublemaker creating accounts over and over again?
And what happened if the said troublemaker happened to use the same ISP as you, and then everybody else got banned?
What happened if the troublemaker used Freeserve? Is it ok to ban 3 million people just to get rid of one troublemaker?
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 8 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström (193.12.32.78) on 25-Jun-2002 14:19 GMT
Without having anything special to say, I hope you can find the time to make user accounts. I feel that it would bring ANN back to a more sane level.
Sure, some might find it a hassle to register, but keeping it the way it is now is unfortunately far worse ..
/Björn
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 9 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 25-Jun-2002 14:25 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (smithy):
Sure there are all those exceptional conditions where it would not work on its own
this is the same problem you have on IRC - even banning a site for period of time.
This is why sucessive bans followed by a complaint to the ISP is sufficient. If the ISP
takes no further action then the existing freeserve customers are banned too and they
will have to complain to the ISP. Nothing like its own customers threatening to desert
to frighten an ISP.
You see if someone had built proper authentication into IP from the start this would be
easy. DCE was a good attempt at this.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 10 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by reflect (194.236.28.191) on 25-Jun-2002 14:29 GMT
I'm fairly new to the community(about 4 months) and a friend of mine pointed me here. At first, I thought it was pretty ok here. Lots of news, lots of comments. But recently, it's gotten worse, and steadier worse by the day.
In my early days, I didn't like login systems for site. I have so many usernames and so many different passwords that I can't even remember them all.
But using ann as an example, I'm all for it now.
Wbr
Andreas Loong
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 11 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 25-Jun-2002 14:31 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (DaveW):
Further to this you could stop someone in a given session from participating on
a site by storing a cookie on their browser with a unique session id effectively
banning them.
Assuming that
they are of the 13 year old stoopid kid variety even logging out and logging in
of their ISP would not stop them from being banned. They would have to clear the
cookie cache out to bypass it, use a different machine or a different browser
which is a further hinderance.
You have to get it to the point where its too much hassle to be a pain in the ar*e
which of course is what the justice system is all about.
Those that will do it despite hinderance are the ones you have to chase from ISP to ISP
and could be policed by other users of the site adding them to their ignore list to
a certain extent.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 12 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas (209.86.102.76) on 25-Jun-2002 14:43 GMT
You can do anything you want, it's your board. But if you want the board to reflect the
real suatus or mindstate of Amiga/Amiga Like users, then you need to leave it open and
moderate/edit only those posts clearly out of bounds.
Amiga.org is biased in a manner that doesn't really reflect the user base. As such it
presents an illusion. And I think we all have had enough illusion. And before anyone
jumps on me here. Plenty made to quick and faulty judgements about me recently, yet I see
the value of openness even with such blame being placed on me and for something I didn't
do, but only preceived or promoted that I did.
Playing in the world of illusion, supporting it, is not going to solve anything, but only
help to insure the illusions continue.
There are those who like using Amiga or Amiga like OSs but don't like Amiga, or UAE or
MorphOS or ..... but it doesn't make any of them not like the OS or OS like. And that's far
more relavant than who likes who, or not.
It's your board, you can do what ever you want, and anyone who doesn't know that, well it
doesn't really matter. But I'm sure that if you want to make it more biased away from a clear
picture of what really is (regardless of what language is used to express it), then you will be
catering to a smaller group, not the whole..
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 13 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Budda (62.252.192.5) on 25-Jun-2002 14:46 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (reflect):
Try using the same unique username and password for your online logins. Makes life a hell of a lot easier!
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 14 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by reflect (194.236.28.191) on 25-Jun-2002 14:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 13 (Budda):
yes! smart idea! Why didn't I think of that? :)
It would also make it easier to screw with me. If you can login to one site, you can login to them all.
I'm too paranoid for that. :)
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 15 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by William F. Maddock (4.23.128.221) on 25-Jun-2002 15:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (smithy):
The problem with moderation comes when moderators fail to be moderate but instead censor based upon their own beliefs and opinions. There is a fine line to be walked, and if it is stepped away from the whole site can lose respect instead of gaining it. I have been a moderator on a website. The toughest decision I had was to delete a post that was not intended as an attack or as an insult, but as a joke. In the end I had to delete a post that had me rolling on the floor laughing. :-(
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 16 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by the man in the shadows (64.216.140.153) on 25-Jun-2002 15:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (3seas):
> Amiga.org is biased
I am biased of my own opinions and statements. I believe everyone shares the same at one point or another, even you Tim. I'm sure you can post anything your heart sees fit over at Amiga.org within the guidelines. In all honesty, I actually welcome your comments as the majority of them are spoken with a level head and don't use cussing or foul language. I'm not saying that I agree with your posts, just that you know how to pose a good argument unlike some of the other well known Amiga users.
I've only had to moderate two posts in the last 6 months, both of which were relating to questionable nudity on the web site. The posts are still there, just the content (images) in question removed. The last time I didn't post a submitted news item was from an account named GoaTroll which had some severely sick perversion to his preferred form of porn.
In all, I have to agree with CK: "something needs to be done to stop a few people from turning any thread into a flamefest". The childish piss & moan contest has gone on for long enough, it's time to bring it to an end. Especially when it comes to the comments made by the anonymous posters.
"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt." - Samuel Clemons
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 17 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox (62.254.64.5) on 25-Jun-2002 15:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (3seas):
For once, Tim wrote sense.
Amiga.org has a nasty atmosphere, like being in a school where the
teacher will throw you out if you don't behave in quite the right way.
You might consider limiting the number of posts from any one address
to so many per week. That would reduce the use of multiple pseudonyms.
The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, and the cost of freedom is
a certain amount of anarchy.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 18 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Angus Manwaring (193.195.0.101) on 25-Jun-2002 16:05 GMT
I think there are 2 priorities:
1. Stop the chaos caused by troublemakers.
2. Don't make huge amounts of work for yourself doing it.
Finally, thanks for your work.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 19 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Andy Hall (195.92.168.166) on 25-Jun-2002 16:45 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (Don Cox):
Amiga.org has a nasty atmosphere, like being in a school where the
teacher will throw you out if you don't behave in quite the right way.
I have to disagree with you there Don. You can post what you want at Amiga.org just like at ANN. I've only seen 2 moderations on Amiga.org, both about nudity (One was clearly a malicious post), compared to many here at ANN. Amiga.org is very much like say the AmigActive ML or the old AFB.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 20 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous (209.86.183.96) on 25-Jun-2002 16:59 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (Don Cox):
>Amiga.org has a nasty atmosphere, like being in a school where the
>teacher will throw you out if you don't behave in quite the right way.
Would you please elaborate? The only things I've 'moderated' are:
1)graphic homosexual porn picture attachments(by RaMonster/GoatRoll etc)
2)extremely excessive flames with extreme abusive language.
It's 'nasty' to moderate the above? Puhlease. We have MOS people(Hi Kronos!), Amithlon people(Hi Bill Hoggett!), and OS4 people(Hi me!). Everyone gets along for the most part. Arguements are almost always constructive, and when things do get heated, aplogising is common.
THAT'S nasty??!?
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 21 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Christian Kemp (213.166.59.194) on 25-Jun-2002 17:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (Andy Hall):
> I've only seen 2 moderations on Amiga.org, both about nudity [..] compared to
> many here at ANN.
If I may ask, what moderations are you referring to? Articles or comments?
Article moderation on ANN is much more open and visible than on other (Amiga) news sites, since the moderation queue ("Unmoderated" category) is clearly visible. It is inevitable to "clean up", so to speak. (Whereas most other sites plain do not post these items.) As for comments, I have done very little (too little?) moderation so far, only removing content when it violated NDAs or other agreements, or on request of the original poster.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 22 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by the man in the shadows (64.216.140.153) on 25-Jun-2002 17:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (Anonymous):
Well said... and by an anonymous poster... Whodathunkit!? 8^)
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 23 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa (209.86.183.96) on 25-Jun-2002 17:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 22 (the man in the shadows):
It was me. My dumb a$$ forgot to put my name in :-/
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 24 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa (209.86.183.96) on 25-Jun-2002 17:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 21 (Christian Kemp):
CK, I'd bet he's reffering to the topless painted breast gif that was floating arround.
As for news submissions, they ALL get reviewed before submittal. Comments and forum posting is quite open, although a user has to register. There is very little that gets removed or editted. Only 1 user has been banned(we all know who that is, no not you Timmy Rue;) )
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 25 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by the man in the shadows (64.216.140.153) on 25-Jun-2002 17:17 GMT
Hey CK, I just thought of something you may want to look into. This would require a few things to be in place before you could put it into effect though:
- User logins
- Comments Threshold
- User "Karma" (a la slashcode style)
This way each user (logged in) could rate other posts where anon posts starting at a -1 and logged in posts starting at a 0. Over time with posts that are given plusses by various users the individual can earn karma. Over time karma can both hurt and help an individual. With an average post of 10-20 positive points earns the individual 1 point of karma where they would post comments starting with a +1 instead of 0.
This would make many people happy. The option to still post anon, the ability to track credibility, and the option to moderate other comments by the end users due to popularity vote. I'm not trying to suggest making ANN into another slashdot, but I think the direction ANN is going, this would be the best option for all of it. If I was any good with Perl, I'd offer to help.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 26 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (195.92.67.68) on 25-Jun-2002 17:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 17 (Don Cox):
So you cant act like a tw@t on Amiga.org for too long before you get succumbed to peer pressure? Excuse me while I burst into tears on your behalf.
I do not see any overtly pro-MOS, pro-Amithlon or pro-AOS agenda, if you post without backing up assertions you are pulled over by your peers from it.
Oh no, its enough to make you go and run behind your mummy and hold on to her coat for dear life.
Sheesh.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 27 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas (209.86.130.26) on 25-Jun-2002 17:57 GMT
To comment on requiring logins (as is the case at Amiga.org???) I am
against it, and again though I have plenty of reason to be for it, there
is a priority that over rules.
Anon (or such that is in essence Anonomus [sp?]) is important in that it
is a way for someone to say something that they would otherwise not say.
Granted that alot of Anon. postings are flame bait and such unproductive
value. There are fewer that are of productive value weight and they far
out weight the nothingness of nonproductive post.
I suspect that for the total count of such posters, that there is
actually a much smaller group or count of actual people. I'm not just
talking about here either, but usenet (as some have found out how to use
anon. posting methods and multipule and perhaps free accounts using
different nicks) and there are other boards as well that allow anon
postings like moobunny.
In a sence, even the anon flame baits are saying someone is being
motivated to do such. And that is a value, to know someone is trouble
enough to feel they need to do such.
I suspect there are far fewer than what we have all seen, who are just out
to generate an arguement. The rest are probably being triggered by
something more.
At any rate, Anon. remailers are created and supported as a matter of
freedom. The sponsors of such machines that protect the poster, believe in
providing a way for those who otherwise would fear perhaps for their life
should they become known (Yeah, from the good to the bad spectrum) are
doing so for the Good ones. I believe if you look up who sponsors are of
such anon. remailers you'd find an impressive list of universities and
organizations.
It is in that spirit of not shutting out the good ones, just because there
are bad ones too.
perhaps this gives some light on what I said about Amiga.org As I believe
to post comments there I have to be registered. BTW, Back when Amiga.org
was hacked badly, Wayne was on vacation. I posted here a suggestion that
someone might contact Waynes ISP and have them unplug Amiga.org until
Wayne got back and sorted things out. I did it under anon. and the reason
was is based on how people in general don't like me. Even later, after it
was done (Amiga.org uplugged) and I had made it known, someone tried to
use it against me, only they had forgotten where they had seen my
admitting I used an anon......
Anon. is useful!
And what about forgeries? Well we do seem to be able to recognize them or
have a forgery pointed out to us when we don't.....
Hey, If I can put up with or at least deal all that I have of anons/fakes
and forgeries...
But then this isn't my board. <shrug> just my perspective.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 28 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Syke (213.114.171.235) on 25-Jun-2002 17:58 GMT
In reply to Comment 25 (the man in the shadows):
This sounds good, except for one thing (that I miss on /.) The option to sort the 4's and 5's "Funny" posts... That's about the only thing I read there. :)
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 29 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by bbrockie (212.242.220.96) on 25-Jun-2002 18:16 GMT
Why not totally disable comments? - If you guys really want to flame/rant about a article go to IRC, there are plenty of channels out there; or even better create your own.
Afterall, all I do on ANN is to read news and articles. I dont give a flying pig about what your oppinions may be, they only suck up my bandwith when reading the important bits.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 30 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by smithy (62.31.144.2) on 25-Jun-2002 19:43 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (DaveW):
>Sure there are all those exceptional conditions where it would not work on its
>own this is the same problem you have on IRC - even banning a site for period
>of time.
It is unacceptable to ban innocent users just because a troublemaker happens to use the same ISP.
>This is why sucessive bans followed by a complaint to the ISP is sufficient.
Many of the so-called troublemakers are doing nothing wrong except expressing a different/controversial opinion. On the recent long thread, CK told off cheesegrate for using the word "Amino" (which I understand is shorthand for saying that Amiga Inc have little to do with the Amiga) and for not using capital letters. Do you think an ISP is going to consider this against their terms of use?
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 31 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa (208.61.41.208) on 25-Jun-2002 19:50 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (smithy):
Oh come on smithy, give CK a break. You know exactly why CK said this.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 32 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Andy Hall (195.92.168.167) on 25-Jun-2002 22:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 21 (Christian Kemp):
>If I may ask, what moderations are you referring to? Articles or comments?
Comments. There have been a few times (mostly recently) where you've had to remove a comment for various valid reasons. The one that sticks in my mind is where two people started posting (presumably insults) in a foreign language. There have been others for excessive bad language.
>Article moderation on ANN is much more open and visible than on other (Amiga) >news sites, since the moderation queue ("Unmoderated" category) is clearly >visible. It is inevitable to "clean up", so to speak. (Whereas most other >sites plain do not post these items.) As for comments, I have done very little >(too little?) moderation so far, only removing content when it violated NDAs >or other agreements, or on request of the original poster.
I think you have got it just right when it comes to news moderation. The Unmoderated section allows the curious to view posts as soon as they are posted, while not affecting those who want moderated news. You get the best of both worlds.
As for the comments, I don't think anyone can complain about you do to little moderation, especially when many threads go 100+. The big problem is that many people tend to fear moderation as some kind of Orwellian Big Brother censorship nightmare, when it really isn't the case. I feel sorry for Christophe, everytime he moderated or posted something he was accused of being some kind of MorphOS nazi, when he was quite clearly he was just doing his job. I think there are too many agendas flying about the Amiga community for anyone to trust anyone else.
TBH I think that ANN is just about right (although sometimes I get depressed by the behaviour displayed by some people), and drastic changes will alter to balance and dynamics of the site. Perhaps trying a bit of zero tolerance with regards to the Comment guidelines (i.e. deleting all insults, abusive language/swearing)? That wouldn't stop trolling, but it would help cool down many a flame war. But then maybe that would be too strict, and again brings up the fear of moderation and bias of moderators.
It's a tricky situation.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 33 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Alan Croft (211.28.96.8) on 25-Jun-2002 23:44 GMT
People do let off steam in these forums, which they wouldn't do in person. One problem is that people can't see your body language. An insult that might be intended in good humour, suddenly seems like a personal attack.
Try and remain calm. In a week that person letting off steam will probably forget the whole incident. And the victim too. Just water under the bridge.
Everyone needs to respect other peoples viewpoints. But they should expect some criticism... and debate on their viewpoint.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 34 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Johan Rönnblom (193.11.248.159) on 26-Jun-2002 00:22 GMT
I think that for articles, the current moderation works well.
For comments, I think the following approach would probably be the
best: Make some function so that you or the other moderators very
easily can remove a comment and replace it with a standard text
("Comment removed due bad netiquette" or something). Of course, this
won't stop people who really, really want to ruin the site,
but in my opinion that's not the problem right now. The problem is
that a lot of people have a hard time just being polite - and I think
they would try harder if they got their comments removed every now and
then. I don't expect you moderators to keep up with every thread, but
I think you could still make a difference.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 35 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström (193.12.32.78) on 26-Jun-2002 01:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 25 (the man in the shadows):
I don't know. Karma/rating just tends to lead to penalism punishing people who simply have a different oppinion than others. People tend to rate people not for bad/good behaviour but for how close/far others views is to their own.
On the other points I agree.
/Björn
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 36 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrate (211.28.96.38) on 26-Jun-2002 02:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 25 (the man in the shadows):
>>I'm not trying to suggest making ANN into another slashdot,
No Kent, you are trying to suggest that ANN becomes more like amiga.org
Frankly that would be very bad.
I relize i may have a bit rude in my comments about this stupid 'promotion' and I apologize to the ann community if certain people felt that degraded the quality of that particular thread.
But I am upset, The issues still stand.
(if you wanna help os4/a1 send your money to eyetech/hyperion ;) for reasons i will not go into again..)
'Ruining the experience for thousands' sorry the situation is there are a 'few' pro censorship advocates calling for moderation when they can't bear to answer the issues.
I don't think christian should have to rewrite his code to satisfy those people unless he is paid by the ann community. As tim, don etc have stated the strength of ann is it's diversity and any such move will degrade that.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 37 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 26-Jun-2002 04:37 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (smithy):
Unnaceptable to whom Smithy? This is standard practice on IRC and even on USENET when
a persistent offender. Perhaps you should read the rest of what I had written on the subject.
You know that the "Amino" phrase is used to wind people up rather than just a "shorthand", I really
dont think you are that dumb and biased as to think it is acceptable to hide behind a dictionary
definition. Facist has an unemotional dictionary definition but teenagers and politions use it as
an insult - as they do "communist".
Login and authentication systems are not perfect, but its better than what the site has at the moment
although I would make much more use of an ignore list.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 38 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 26-Jun-2002 04:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 36 (cheesegrate):
Cheesegrate, I dont think it is just deliberately using the "Amino" word it is
the fact that you deliberately go into every thread to stir the sh!t to the point
where we have yet another flamewar. That may be where you feel most comfortable
but we end up with barely and unrelated threads heading towards the MOS/AOS/BPlan/A1
flamewar with you pushing vigorously for it to happen.
This means that comments section either make people feel fed up and they dont
come back to ANN or people looking in on what the Amiga userbase are think we
are all like you OR the personalities represented when people are pushed to the
edge by you.
Sure others have been just as guilty of it in the past but when the general consensus
has been to just cool off about it and stop the baiting most of the rest have stopped
but you just continued. Despite people trying to get you to stop.
So, you now have a reputation for the most immature trolling known to ANN which
you are going to find really hard to lose ( you can barely help yourself in your
comment above ), ANN gets a bad reputation ( see the comments on other sites about it )
and the outside world gets a bad impression of Amiga users in general.
If you want to have a flame fest and transient reputations then, as was said earlier,
media where what you say is gone as soon as it scrolls off the screen is for you
(irc).
For the first time in years ( yes! ) we actually have some products close to being
on sale to the general public and we can even begin to advocate the Amiga platform
for new users again. Would any of us want to bring new users into this mess? Doubt it.
I think you should draw a line under all what has gone on before, walk away for
a few weeks and months and come back without all this baggage.
Congratulations guys the Amiga userbase experience is now as bad as the Linux
userbase experience.
W E L L D O N E
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 39 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström (217.150.160.130) on 26-Jun-2002 05:06 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (DaveW):
Thanks for making this comment.
/Björn
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 40 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by koan (193.133.140.104) on 26-Jun-2002 06:14 GMT
I would prefer not having to login just to post a comment.
I think readers of ANN shouldn't respond to the
few stupid people who set out to start flamewars.
I get fed up with having to skip through 20 replies
to a single flame bait.
If CK wants to delete posts he feels are OTT then that's
fine with me, it's his site.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 41 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by AmiTroll (216.8.144.108) on 26-Jun-2002 06:43 GMT
Well, a custom ignore list for each visitor is a bit over the top imho :P But i dont mind logging in if i have to, just to post a few comments. Add a IP ban list and things will clean up alot. Just one thing i'd like to point out though, you wont solve all the problems and get rid of all the morons, this will just make it a little easier in the long run. The best way is active moderation. Start with a system to allow your moderators to edit or kill a post or whole thread and then add login systems and all the extras if your up to the work. Just my 2 cents.
GRUNT
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 42 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 26-Jun-2002 06:55 GMT
If using SQL backed cgi
Just have a table that can be looked at on each comments display. Find out who is
on the ignore list:
SELECT ignoreid FROM ignoretab WHERE userid=$curuser
Then build the expression for the comments query where the contents of the
enumeration returned from the query before are built into the where clause
SELECT * FROM comments WHERE newsid=$curnews AND commentuid != .... AND commentuid != ....
let SQL take the strain
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 43 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Daniel Miller (65.129.20.113) on 26-Jun-2002 08:24 GMT
I think the anonymous posts and insults and constant fighting ruin ANN. I genuinely believe they drive many decent people away. Yes, you should make some of the changes you are considering.
Firstly, add the ability to ban certain IP ranges. You can get the worst of the worst this way. You might also formulate a policy to get the IP range or poster "reinstated." Perhaps an exception could be made to innocent participants from the banned IP range, ie. they could post from a specific email address, which would be pre-approved?
Secondly, disable anonymous postings. Require that an email address with correct syntax (*@*.*) be entered. Yes they could fake this but it makes it a little more difficult.
I know this is more work for the administrators, but in my opinion it would make ANN a better place to exchange views and get news.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 44 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrate (210.49.51.75) on 26-Jun-2002 09:04 GMT
Yes keep working boys..! on those ignore lists and ip blockers.
You are doing well.. ! soon you will only hear your own voices that agree with your ideology..
@davew
i'm not even going to bother to respond to your attack.. suffice to say when your in the glasshouse..
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 45 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by Christian Kemp (80.255.160.125) on 26-Jun-2002 09:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 44 (cheesegrate):
> soon you will only hear your own voices that agree with your ideology..
How many times do I still need to point out that I do not object to people expressing an opinion, but to HOW they sometimes express it...
Who's the "you" in your statement above, by the way?
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 46 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.110.14) on 26-Jun-2002 09:25 GMT
In reply to Comment 44 (cheesegrate):
Im glad you realise you are standing in a glass house. Note that you did respond and
the fact that you saw it as an "attack" suggests you are not actually reading what
people write.
Again.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 47 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrate (210.49.51.75) on 26-Jun-2002 10:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 45 (Christian Kemp):
>>Who's the "you" in your statement above, by the way?
just the amiga.org pple who now reside here as well (davew, redrumla, samface, amigammc etc) and now are wishing and praying for logins, ip blocking and 'wayne style' censorship..
As you said yourself the best thing is too ignore, but these people( like when the amigan in black thread happened) will seek to censor and black out anything that disagrees with their rose tinted view.
Oh and when things don't go their way they wil complain about trolls, lies, biased moderators, the reputation ?! of ann on other sites. But of course when samface starts spreading FUD about A REAL PRODUCT then we have silence from these people.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 48 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.100.34) on 26-Jun-2002 10:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 47 (cheesegrate):
All suggesting you still havent read anything I have said.
I really dont give a toss if you are pro MOS or anti MOS, I give a toss about the fact that you more than anyone else has little clue as to what they are talking about, laces their posts with childish barbs and *still* expects others to read it. Ive put this politely and in detail above and you did not read it properly. You will note that lame behaviour with diametrically opposed views from yourself from certain other userids gets short shrift from me too.
Amiga.org people? What the 'ell are you on?
Just because you want to put me into a nice category where you think you wont have to listen to what I am saying and you hope that you will incite others with your particular beliefs to rally around you by making it an pro-or-anti MOS issue does not make you any the less pathetic.
It is just this kind of thing you have been doing on pretty much every other thread - turning it into a pro or anti MOS issue.
Grow up dude.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 49 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrater (210.49.51.75) on 26-Jun-2002 10:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 48 (DaveW):
>It is just this kind of thing you have been doing on pretty much every other thread - turning >it into a pro or anti MOS issue.
again mr w, i did not mention mos. IT IS YOU that keeps bringing it up. But you are obviously too far gone to relize this. Stop with the generliasations already;) 'the most immature troller' 'every other thread'. It dosn't help your cause.
Weekend away / Stricter moderation? : Comment 50 of 94ANN.lu
Posted by DaveW (194.196.100.34) on 26-Jun-2002 10:26 GMT
In reply to Comment 49 (cheesegrater):
I get it, English isnt your first language and you are having trouble translating the grammer.
That must be it.
Try reading what I say rather than what you would have liked me to say.
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