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[News] new Screenshots of Rage Harde releasedANN.lu
Posted on 09-Jul-2002 09:56 GMT by Martin Wollert135 comments
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you can find new screenshots from the MorphOS Game Rage Hard here RageHardPic
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 51 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 00:24 GMT
In reply to Comment 39 (Mike Veroukis):
The GPL doesn't say anything about "the public at large" or "beta testing". The rule is source-follows-binary, so in the example of giving a friend a "beta test" copy of some software, that friend would automatically receive the rights granted by the GNU GPL, including the right to redistribute the software and to get source code from you.
IF you give someone a binary THEN you must offer them source. It's that simple.
"Forcing developers to release every bit of code that touches a GPL license is silly and generally not very useful to the community."
It's to the advantage of the users to be able to get source code for software they use, no matter whether the developer thinks it is "finished" or not. How many Amiga programs that had a lot of potential were unfinished and then sank out of sight, only for someone else to start all over again? With the GNU GPL that time need not have been wasted.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 52 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 00:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 48 (Anonymous):
Steffen agreed to a license from ID software, and then broke it.
He doesn't like it when people point that out, so he starts arguing, and then when he loses the argument he becomes very childish and starts using ad hominem attacks and scribbling awful self-pitying rants.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 53 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 10-Jul-2002 02:01 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Anonymous):
@217.34.64.220
Why don't you grow a set of balls before you post such tripe? Why do cowards feel like men when they are hiding behind a keyboard?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 54 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 10-Jul-2002 02:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 52 (Anonymous):
@217.34.64.220
Uh huh, suuuuuuure.. And you are who? John Carmack? RS?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 55 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 03:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 53 (redrumloa):
It's not necessary for me to attach a name to the truth. The truth speaks just as loudly no matter who is talking.
Even when I offer opinions instead of truth I'm more on target than you are, redrumloa, few people believed me when I said that AInc would try the "Pay now, products later" trick again this summer, and well...
Meanwhile you accepted a bet on 1500 coupons being sold. Kronos really saw you coming there. Try to have the good grace to concede early :)
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 56 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Kjetil on 10-Jul-2002 04:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (takemehomegrandma):
Linux Do not HAVE DirectX Drivers, DirectX is for Windows made by Microsoft, Linux uses OpenGL drivers form hardware manufactories like Nivida, generally if it works on Linux then it uses OpenGL.
Any software renderer that can run on 68k Amiga can be used on MOS,
Most new games use OpenGL, most not so old games have support for DirectX and OpenGL, older games uses only DirectX, rely old games uses non standard software rendrers.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 57 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrate on 10-Jul-2002 06:34 GMT
Congratulations to the developers of RageHard.
It seems to be a big step forward for amiga gaming.
I'm sure it will be avaible for os4 whenvever it comes out.
I understand this is an original game not a port.
Excellent work
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 58 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrate on 10-Jul-2002 06:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 54 (redrumloa):
>>Uh huh, suuuuuuure.. And you are who? John Carmack? RS?
Richard Stallman perhaps ? ;)
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 59 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Steffen Haeuser on 10-Jul-2002 06:45 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Anonymous):
Anonymous: Repeating wrong claims does not help
you. And no the GNU GPL does not say anything about
"giving copies of a program". It says something about
distributing a program (telling the same over and over again).
And as of now this has not
happened. Also please read Comment 39, which explains
these things in a good way.
And as to comment 48: No, I do not own Quake 2. Still I think
people could ask. And they should not "use" it to advertise
MorphOS, while I am on the OS 4 side. Especially as it was not
even shown on MorphOS. Okay, possible that the guy writing
the report made this whole MorphOS-connection up. Anyways, after
I emailed with the two guys on the issue later, they admitted
themselves making a mistake by not asking. And at no time they
asked for any source code, independent if they would be allowed
to get it or no :)
Hey, really strange, all those people with those strange views do
not have the guts to post under a real name with a real email, but
are anonymous cowards :) Says a lot ...
Steffen
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 60 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by TBone on 10-Jul-2002 07:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 59 (Steffen Haeuser):
Am I misunderstanding you, or are you saying "giving out copies of a program" is not the same as "distribution" under the GPL license?
The way I thought I understood the situation previously, was that "you" never distributed the binaries, and that someone "leaked" them to different people, placing the burdon of conforming to the GPL on the person who "leaked" the program, not you. Is this an accurate estimation of the scenario?
I can't speak for all developers, but IBM *insists* all betatesters, pedestrians, helicopter pilots, or barmaids that even mention or have anything to DO with a binary derived from GPL code, in any state, have full unfettered access to the source code to that binary, regardless of what stage of beta it's in or the phases of the moon.
I'm not sure myself how the GPL defines "distribution" so I've just emailed both them, and ID software, just out of my own curiosity, to see what they think, presenting this as a hypothetical scenario, as I'm really not sure myself.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 61 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Daniel Miller on 10-Jul-2002 07:26 GMT
In reply to Comment 59 (Steffen Haeuser):
Steffan Haeuser typed:
> Hey, really strange, all those people with those strange
> views do not have the guts to post under a real name with
> a real email, but are anonymous cowards :) Says a lot ...
They should be ignored in my opinion. You can't really stop that crap. Most of the time its the same f***ing dopes under different pseudonyms. If they don't have the courage to put their names on these comments why should anyone bother to respond. Don't let it get under your skin.
Sometimes I will see an anonymous comment that is not a troll and I would like to respond to, but I still think "no, better not respond," I don't want to encourage it.
One person had the excuse "oh I don't want spam mail" and the other "So and so might email me a virus" :) but its just lame excuses, from lamers. I don't get much spam at this address. I don't think ANY spam I get is from spammers who scan ANN. Most of these guys just want to run off at the mouth and never have to answer for it and be responsible for their words.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 62 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Christian Kemp on 10-Jul-2002 07:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 61 (Daniel Miller):
ANN's robots.txt is set to dis-allow access to any page other than index.html, which does not even exist anymore. Of course, some spiders will just ignore this and scan the main page, comments and/or archives anyway. I do get a fair amount of spam for ann_notify@ann.lu, which is only used in a form on the main page, in fact more so than at the ckemp@ann.lu address that is more widely used.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 63 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Lando / Trinity on 10-Jul-2002 08:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 60 (TBone):
>The way I thought I understood the situation previously, was that "you" never
>distributed the binaries, and that someone "leaked" them to different people,
>placing the burdon of conforming to the GPL on the person who "leaked" the
>program, not you. Is this an accurate estimation of the scenario?
The leaked binaries of Q2 that appeared a while back were due to a different backstabbing beta-tester, not the two being talked about in this thread. Sending copies of WIP software to members of your team (ie. Beta Testers) so that they can test it is NOT distribution, no matter how these anonymous cowards try to make it sound.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 64 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Ole-Egil Hvitmyren on 10-Jul-2002 09:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 63 (Lando / Trinity):
Well, if these guys are right the world is up shit creek. Because then if I at some time consider compiling my project against a GPL library (NOT LGPL, as that is quite a different kettle of fish) and do a test version that some friend tests on his computer, I have to give out my complete source code even if I decide the GPL library is not worth it, because it doesn't work at all.
This is NOT the way forward. An internal betatest release is internal for a reason, no matter if the end result will be GPL. Oh, and btw, stop feeding the trolls, everyone.
Yeah, that includes you as well, Ole-Egil.
Ok, sir.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 65 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by TBone on 10-Jul-2002 09:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 64 (Ole-Egil Hvitmyren):
"Well, if these guys are right the world is up shit creek. Because then if I at some time consider compiling my project against a GPL library (NOT LGPL, as that is quite a different kettle of fish) and do a test version that some friend tests on his computer, I have to give out my complete source code even if I decide the GPL library is not worth it, because it doesn't work at all. "
These were the same rules that the developers of the code you recieved in the first place, played by. You must have intended at one point, obviously, to distribute source, having chosen GPL work to base yours on. (royal use of "you" being used)
You must give the recipient the same rights you have, those rights are not subject to your estimation of the usefullness or state of revision of the code in question.
You always have the option of not using the GPL code in the first place, but if you agree to the GPL's conditions, then you've weighed the pro's and con's beforehand, right? If abiding to the license isn't acceptable, you always have the option of not basing your work on said licenses software.
If someone "steals" the binary to your code, however, this is not distribution, the "thief" is the distributer, and you have no liability, as it is the "thief" who hasn't complied with the GPL, not you.
I'm not sure what the problem here is, if it's a pain in the ass to supply the source, you do realise that you have the option of charging for that task, no? It's also very trivial to just publish the source on usenet, or throw it on a free webpage.
I still think I'm missunderstanding the issue, was the binary distributed or not? If it wasn't, there's no problem anyway.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 66 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Pegasos jsut rocks on 10-Jul-2002 10:03 GMT
Ah finally proof ,thats a lark the proof has been here a while. It looks a lot better then that crap on a mac
clone box called the a1. That isnt even runnnign 4.0 go figure. Full morpos here
and on the Pegasos system which is Dual G6 ready . The so called a1 cant even hope for the single G4.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 67 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 10-Jul-2002 10:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 66 (Pegasos jsut rocks):
Hi Shawn! How is that G4 A2000 accelerator working?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 68 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Mike on 10-Jul-2002 10:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 67 (redrumloa):
should I , no I wont sink down to stupid ass redumbla level . Im not shawn Im Mike,but alot that
you care if you dont agree you argue or take peoples posted commentthat are right off the Amiga.org.
red you need a life and by the way I dont think he said G4 it was 604e which is a G3. This again , redumbla
shows what a complet jerk you really are. Talked to much ,hell he will argue with that.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 69 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 10-Jul-2002 10:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 68 (Mike):
>red you need a life and by the way I dont think he said G4 it was 604e which is a G3.
Hi Shawn!
Ok so how's that A2000 G3 accelerator working?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 70 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Lando / Trinity on 10-Jul-2002 11:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 68 (Mike):
>I dont think he said G4 it was 604e which is a G3. This again , redumbla
604e is G2 - I have one in my A4000
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 71 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Linchpin on 10-Jul-2002 11:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 68 (Mike):
>I dont think he said G4 it was 604e which is a G3.
Uhmm the 604 is not a 3rd generation PPC but a second generation PPC (G2) just like
the 603 (but MUCH faster:-).
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 72 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Linchpin on 10-Jul-2002 11:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 70 (Lando / Trinity):
I really should learn to type and post faster :-)
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 73 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by alan buxey on 10-Jul-2002 11:58 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Anonymous):
dear Mr anonymous.
please learn facts before posting...and once you DO have the balls
to actually identify yourself we might be able to appreciate your
'enlightenment' a little bit more.
perhaps ANN should ditch anonymous posting? THEN we'll see the real
people
alan
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 74 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Eva on 10-Jul-2002 12:05 GMT
In reply to Comment 26 (Steffen Haeuser):
I can answer for myself.
I bought Heretic2 and Shogo for PianetaAmiga in Empoli (Italy) during the last two years.
I asked to my dealer to NOT BUY for me Freespace simply for Hyperion ideas about marketing.
It's unacceptable to sustain a company that uses word like legal action (BE CLEAR, ONLY WORDS! ala Microsoft) to destroy another company, while every wise person know on which bases these claims are based.
Answers like "It's marketing" are for me unacceptable, because THIS is not the marketing, but Microdsoft style to solve a "problem" ... fullfill the "enemy" with sheet.
This is why I don't buy Freespace.
PS
And I'm excuse with you Steffen, because you are a good programmer and freespace a meritable title.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 75 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by MIKE on 10-Jul-2002 13:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 59 (Steffen Haeuser):
Steffan, I don't want to berate you, but I think you are using some creativity in describing what the GPL allows and doesn't allow, I'll post the *official* html version of the license so that you might go through it, tell me where your seeing these distinctions that you mention, remember this is a license that you agreed to, you have no rights to alter the license whatsoever. I'm not a GPL nazi, but I believe your interpretation of the GPL is quite incorrect, and you as a contractor for a commercial companies, should be very sensitive to licensing issues. I propose if you don't like the terms of the license, don't use the software (and thereby agree to the terms of the license), or get an alternate license from the author.
http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 76 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Steffen Haeuser on 10-Jul-2002 14:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Anonymous):
Hi!
Anonymous: In one word: "No". I don't know why I even spend any (virtual) breath on it...
I wonder what you want to achieve... that I delete both source and Binary of Quake 2 and that it will never appear ? (Don't worry, guys, that won't happen :) And it will be released not too far in the future :) )
If what you want would be true, everybody would be in breach of contract when using a GPL'ed Source, unless he puts his harddrive into the net for public download already *while* developing :) Funny idea...
I am not obliged to release anything until I actually distribute Quake 2. End of discussion.
Steffen
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 77 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Coolio on 10-Jul-2002 15:15 GMT
Ladies, it was ALSO recently announced that the game ETHNIC CLEANSING (http://www.resistance.com/ethniccleansing/catalog.htm) is being ported to MorphOS!!! It's billed as the most politically incorrect video game EVER made! Linux and Amiga can KEEP old games like Payback and Quake 2! The future is now with MorphOS!! The spirit of Jay Miner lives on!!!! Give MorphOS a try just for Ethnic Cleansing!!!!
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 78 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by John Bower on 10-Jul-2002 15:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 76 (Steffen Haeuser):
"If what you want would be true, everybody would be in breach of contract when using a GPL'ed Source, unless he puts his harddrive into the net for public download already *while* developing :) Funny idea... "
Uh, no.. it doesn't require that, frankly I find your complete disregard for the rights of the people who's shoulders you're standing on quite arrogant.
It's very simple to include the source to those same individuals you provided the binaries to. It's not your decision, it was the decision of ID software, who chose this as the license for "their" code.
The fact you think "you" don't have to abide by the license everyone else does is disgusting.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 79 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 16:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 51 (Anonymous):
>The GPL doesn't say anything about "the public at large" or "beta testing".
>The rule is source-follows-binary, so in the example of giving a friend
>a "beta test" copy of some software, that friend would automatically receive
>the rights granted by the GNU GPL, including the right to redistribute the
>software and to get source code from you.
I don't believe this is in the true spirit of the GPL license. However, even by your definition above the public has the right to the source code only when the binary is available to the public. In such a case beta testers do not count as the public, they are part of the developemt/testing team. So perhaps they could demand the source but that does not mean they could distribute it themselves.
- Mike
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 80 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 16:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 76 (Steffen Haeuser):
"I wonder what you want to achieve..."
In the short term, our goal is to improve user understanding outside the traditional (ie Unix) community. This will make sure that users know what they are entitled to, and how to use the rights granted to them effectively.
One way that we can do that is by stepping in and correcting people when they try to spread misinformation, which is what has happened here.
In the long term, our goal is to make proprietary software obsolete, and put the users back in charge of their computers. Yes, that goal is hostile to your current employment Steffen, and I make no apology for that.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 81 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 10-Jul-2002 16:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 78 (John Bower):
>It's very simple to include the source to those same individuals you provided
>the binaries to. It's not your decision, it was the decision of ID software,
>who chose this as the license for "their" code.
What do you care if the beta testers got the source code or not?
>The fact you think "you" don't have to abide by the license everyone else does
>is disgusting.
If you think ID Software has been wronged, send them an email. Otherwise **** *** **** **!
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 82 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Lando / Trinity on 10-Jul-2002 16:31 GMT
In reply to Comment 78 (John Bower):
>Uh, no.. it doesn't require that, frankly I find your complete disregard for
>the rights of the people who's shoulders you're standing on quite arrogant.
>
>It's very simple to include the source to those same individuals you provided
>the binaries to. It's not your decision, it was the decision of ID software,
>who chose this as the license for "their" code.
>
>The fact you think "you" don't have to abide by the license everyone else does
>is disgusting.
Err.. The stupidity of some people in this thread is quite hilarious.
As has already been said numerous times, Quake 2 hasn't been distributed hence there is no obligation to distribute the source code.
I assume they didnt mention beta testers specifically in the GPL because they credited people with enough intelligence to work out for themselves that giving binaries to members of your own team for testing doesn't count as distribution. It seems they were wrong...
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 83 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Lando / Trinity on 10-Jul-2002 16:34 GMT
In reply to Comment 80 (Anonymous):
>In the long term, our goal is to make proprietary software obsolete, and put
>the users back in charge of their computers.
LOL :) You guys crack me up.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 84 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Read the GPL on 10-Jul-2002 16:53 GMT
In reply to Comment 82 (Lando / Trinity):
http://slashdot.org/articles/99/09/22/0755214.shtml
This issue HAS ben around before, and people like you have already been set straight, do we REALLY need to go through this again?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 85 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Lando / Trinity on 10-Jul-2002 17:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 84 (Read the GPL):
>http://slashdot.org/articles/99/09/22/0755214.shtml
>
>This issue HAS ben around before, and people like you have already been set
>straight, do we REALLY need to go through this again?
<sarcasm>Yes please. I'm really interested.</sarcasm>
That three-year-old slashdot snippet tells me nothing.
As Steffen has already said, nobody requested the Q2 source code and was told they couldn't have it. Where is the GPL violation?
Personally, this whole discussion has put me off ever touching GPL code or releasing anything I write under it. The linux geeks can keep it.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 86 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 17:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 79 (Anonymous):
Quotes are from the body of the GNU GPL
"Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the
Program), the RECIPIENT AUTOMATICALLY RECEIVES A LICENSE from the
original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to
these terms and conditions."
[My emphasis]
"You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein."
It doesn't matter whether you call the recipients "customers" or "beta testers" or "putrid humanoid lifeforms", they automatically receive the rights that all users of GPL protected software expect.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 87 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 17:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 85 (Lando / Trinity):
No OS4 for you then, nor Amithlon, nor UAE. Hmm, why are you reading ANN ?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 88 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 10-Jul-2002 18:38 GMT
To the GPL trolls:
I am a Quake 2 beta tester. I do have the *RIGHT* to get the source code.
If I ask for it, I'll get it. Do *I* want it? *NO*. So, I did *NOT* ask
for it. Did the betatester that leaked the beta *ASK* for the source code
to distribute it with the beta? *NO*. He had the right to get the source.
*HE* breached the contract. It's like if I downloaded a GPL product, was
too bored to DL the source, and didn't provide it with the binary, or
even in a different archive.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 89 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Steffen Haeuser on 10-Jul-2002 18:59 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Anonymous):
Hi!
Anonymous:
With your reasoning you'd have to release the source code once you typed the
first character and used something in GPL. As I said before as long as I
did not distribute Quake 2 I am not obliged to release any source code.
Any other discussion is useless. And no, Betatester is not distribution
(unless the GPL would write somewhere "distribution in our view also includes
Betaversions" - but there is nothing like this anywhere in the GPL). And I think
there is a reason why this is not included. The reason is if it WOULD be included
you could no longer betatest GPL-ed programs, and would need to release
untested versions... and this would make GPL-ed stuff completely useless
for Developers of course. And after all the makers of the GPL surely wanted
it to be used :)
I am not willing to give the GPL any more
power than it is actually demanding and will execute it TO THE LETTER, after all those
annoying discussins with GPL fanatics. GPL
fanatics like you are those hurting "the mission of the GPL" most. And I recommend you
to read comment 39 of Mike Veroukis again in case you still did not get it.
And I have to repeat again "Biting the hand which feeds you is an extremely
popular sport in the Amiga community." Sigh. Why am I even bother talking to a
person who does not even believe in his own words enough to sign with his
real name.
To all you patient people I can say at this place that this time Quake 2
really is nearing completion, together with ports of around 40 Game-Mods (most of the
Mods are Closed-Source, BTW, before someone asks - some are also Open-Source,
though, and one, StarWars Quake 2 is even GPL). You should be able play it soon.
And yes, the source-code of Quake 2 will be also available then, at a time not too
far in the future.
Steffen Haeuser
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 90 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Lando / Trinity on 10-Jul-2002 19:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 87 (Anonymous):
>Hmm, why are you reading ANN ?
Actually I've been asking myself that question a lot lately... Perhaps because there has to be a few decent people left here to balance out all the anonymous trolls?
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 91 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Sauron Bigmouth on 10-Jul-2002 19:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 85 (Lando / Trinity):
"Personally, this whole discussion has put me off ever touching GPL code or releasing anything I write under it. "
Well I hope whatever license you do choose get's better respected than the respect you show the licenses others choose, good luck.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 92 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 19:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 59 (Steffen Haeuser):
>Hey, really strange, all those people with those strange views do
>not have the guts to post under a real name with a real email, but
>are anonymous cowards :) Says a lot ...
Yes, yes...we are so afraid of your inhouse master lawyer!
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 93 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 19:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 76 (Steffen Haeuser):
>I wonder what you want to achieve... that I delete both source and Binary
>of Quake 2 and that it will never appear ?
If you like to be so mean, just go ahead!
We see it's just an ego-thing of yours and you are not interested in the
ideas and responsibilities of GPL. And no, we won't kiss your feet, because
you see yourself as "the hand that feeds" the Amigans!
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 94 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Eva on 10-Jul-2002 22:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 75 (MIKE):
Mike. I abosolutely agree.
But you have understand that for Hyperion every law, licence and so on can be modified by some Hyperion guys words :(
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 95 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Eva on 10-Jul-2002 22:24 GMT
In reply to Comment 76 (Steffen Haeuser):
Excuse me, but really. It's time to be clear.
I will post Hyperion members opinions on some Id-soft and Activision mails to clear the legal position of Hyperion with Quake2 GPL license.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 96 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by TBone on 10-Jul-2002 22:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 76 (Steffen Haeuser):
"If what you want would be true, everybody would be in breach of contract when using a GPL'ed Source, unless he puts his harddrive into the net for public download already *while* developing :) Funny idea... "
As a matter of fact, that wouldn't be good enough :P The GPL doesn't require net access to the source, but here's another interesting fact, Net access to the source does -not- satisfy the GPL, even -with- net access to the source, the source -must- be available for mail order.
I hadn't realised this, and just stumbled upon it myself, but it is a good idea. This makes it easier for you afterall, as you don't have to lift a finger untill someone actually wants to order the source, at which point you get to charge a fair fee (some recomend $35 for a CD) for burning a CD to satisfy those people bugging you :)
It is an interesting subject though, I don't think I've seen this issue raised before.
Granted if the binary was leaked, you have no liability whatsoever, but could optionally sell the CD for $35 if you deemed it worthwhile anyway :)
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 97 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 23:07 GMT
In reply to Comment 96 (TBone):
>(some recomend $35 for a CD)
Must have been from a time CD-Rs were really precious and the burning drives dog slow...
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 98 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 10-Jul-2002 23:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 89 (Steffen Haeuser):
"The reason is if it WOULD be included
you could no longer betatest GPL-ed programs, and would need to release
untested versions... and this would make GPL-ed stuff completely useless
for Developers of course. And after all the makers of the GPL surely wanted
it to be used :)"
This is utter nonsense. Anyone would think that you'd never seen a GPL'd software project in your life. You are a small time game developer and we run the development for three operating systems, a compiler suite and associated tool chains, dozens of end users applications, desktop environments, network services and other software totalling many hundreds of millions of lines of code and YOU claim that our way of doing things is "useless" ?
Yes, of course source code needs to be available as soon as you start distributing software, whether it is to unpaid "beta testers", to professional stuntmen or to housewives at the supermarket. Simply include the source code "in the box" or use a proper tagged revision control system so that you can check out the right version if a user asks for it.
We do this automatically and without thinking. If it is so hard for you then I must begin to doubt your competence as a software engineer.
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 99 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Steffen Haeuser on 11-Jul-2002 07:05 GMT
In reply to Comment 91 (Sauron Bigmouth):
Hi!
As to comment 86: But then I did *not* redistribute any copies of Q2 so the
passage does not apply :) And you can be sure I will make the source-code
available once I actually distribute Quake 2. But not a second earlier.
To Alkis:
> I am a Quake 2 beta tester. I do have the *RIGHT* to get the source code.
> If I ask for it, I'll get it. Do *I* want it? *NO*. So, I did *NOT* ask
> for it. Did the betatester that leaked the beta *ASK* for the source code
> to distribute it with the beta? *NO*. He had the right to get the source.
He hadn't, as he only had the "old" port which was started from scratch again due
it being a quick-and-dirty-port and at one point we decided we wanted to do it
really clean. At the "start" of the project we thought of just a quick-and-dirty
port like for other OpenSource games. The source-code of the old port does not
exist anymore. And as he has not the Binary of the new port, he obviously
could not ask for it's source, even if you'd count Beta-Versions as
Distribution (what is NOT the case). It is right though, that no Betatester
ever asked for the source-code. Most of the testers agree with me with my
view on what "Distribution" means in the GPL BTW.
To Comment 92: Not a question of laws, but a question of behaviour. If you
don't put your name under something, you keep your mouth shut !
Eva: (Comment 94): No. But we don't need to confirm to something which
is not required by the law (or in this case by the GPL).
Comment 95: Feel free to do so. But keep your facts straight. Even after
the view of the GPL-Fanatics who think a Beta-Version would be distribution
NONE of the Betatesters asked of the Source Code. And someone else would not
be entitled to have the source-code even after the view of the Betatesters.
If you start any lies there, legal action might follow, be aware of this.
TBone and Anonymous: This was not referring to the "actual GPL", but to some stupid theory
Anonymous had above. IF this theory about the GPL would be true (but it isn't)
this would follow (so obviously it is NOT the case, like you said yourselves).
Steffen Haeuser
new Screenshots of Rage Harde released : Comment 100 of 135ANN.lu
Posted by Ben Yoris on 11-Jul-2002 07:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 99 (Steffen Haeuser):
To Steffen : my advice is to stop talking about Quake II in such forums.
Let's finish and release Quake II and that's all.
Some people here seems to prefer annoying some of the last developers on the Amiga (whether it's Hyperion or not) rather than enjoying the fact that some new 3D games are coming to the Amiga.
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