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[News] News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org)ANN.lu
Posted on 22-Sep-2002 16:55 GMT by 120 comments
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News mentioned on the event (complements the other show report below) From www.amiga.org:

PPCBoot by Hyperion is finished and handed out to existing (35-40 or so) betatesters - seen working for the first time on the event (I saw an ATI Radeon start screen among others...)

With this done, the rest of the developerboards (a couple of hundred) can now be shipped to developers. Allow some two weeks to make sure the betatesters don't find any obvious problems.

PPCboot apparantly contains some pretty nifty features by the Frieden brothers (but I leave that report to those there with better technical knowledge (and memory!) than me). PPCBoot was made due to an outside (in the meaning 'outside Amiga market') contract, creating some nice revenue for Hyperion.

Apart from the boot process being cumbersome (since PPCBoot didn't exist), according to Alan no AOne hardware problems whatsoever have been reported by the betatesters since may this year.

Alan Redhouse presented the AOne XE with replacable CPU and gave some very interesting numbers (which I leave to him to put on the web - he didn't want us to quote him on those). This card looks very promising anyways.

Due to plenty of requests from Amigans, Eyetech have changed their minds and will sell the AOne G3-SE before AOS4 is available - but as such including the licence to later get the OS (after all it wouldn't be an AOne without the OS and the ROM). The G3-SE will hopefully ship before christmas, and the -XE slightly after christmas. AOS4 for CyberstormPPC will come about around the same time, followed by the version for AOne probably after christmas (it should be noted that this was Alan's approximations - as I recall them - and not anything official from Hyperion).

AOS4 was presented by Gunne Steen of GGS-Data. He received a beta version from Hyperion for this particular presentation. It ran on his Cyberstorm PPC and he loaded modules on top of his OS3.9 installation, such as Intuition.library (giving new menus and configurability) and layers.library. He also showed some special effects modules like one that clipped all windows/pointers/graphics when they moved within an inch of the edge of the screen (perhaps not that useful, but interesting as an example of what's possible) All windows can be iconified and placed on the WB desktop. The Media Toolbox does indeed seem to be a very powerful program.

According to Stefan Burström, who was at the show, MUI will be included in OS4, but initially locked in a configuration that matches the look of Reaction. If you have a keyfile it will be changeable as usual of course.

Stefan Burström held a little (improvised) speech on IBrowse 2.3. This version is (as we knew) mainly a bugfix for everything that was wrong in 2.2 and is as such a vast improvement. However new features such as CSS will not be implemented until IBrowse 3.0, which is going to be PPC native. IB2.3 is free for registered users of 2.2.

There were plenty of people on the event. According to one of the people arranging the show, they calclulated some 200 amigans showing up for the few hours the event took place. There were people of every age, race, nationality and gender there, and generally a nice atmopsphere (albeit somewhat crowded..) Thanks to the enthusiasts arranging this, you did a darn good job!

News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 51 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anders Kjeldsen on 23-Sep-2002 16:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 46 (Gunne Steen):
Gunne: Any sales of Pegasos? ;)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 52 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Ridiculous! on 23-Sep-2002 17:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 45 (samface):
"Sure, Amiga Inc. have had their delays and broken promises but then, how long have the MorphOS fanatics been waiting again? Since 1997 AFAIK."
Errm... MorphOS was announced in 2000 for the first time. 1997? Come one...
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 53 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by reflect on 23-Sep-2002 17:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 47 (samface):
I know it's not the law, but I wouldn't want to be the one trying the EULA in court. Sometimes those things can get rather costsome.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 54 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Elektro on 23-Sep-2002 17:23 GMT
That's one of the problems of the PPC platform, no DDR support... Lousy...
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 55 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 23-Sep-2002 17:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (cOrpse):
I didn't talk about it's legallity. I talked about what he said.
That it would be more interesting to see it on "Amiga hardware"
and not a wierdo foreign board.
He seems to forget that MacOnLinux was tested on AmigaOne FIRST.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 56 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by mensa on 23-Sep-2002 18:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 55 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
Alkis Tsapanidis honoured "samface" by quoting him/it:
"That it would be more interesting to see it on "Amiga hardware"
and not a wierdo foreign board."
Come on. Samface is a troll and apparently mildly retarded. If he/it thinks there will be "Amiga hardware", let him/it do so. Not even Amiga Inc. can convince him of the opposite. When he/it spews forth such crap in public it'll only serve to help people identify his/its posts as total nonsense devoid of credibility (after all, there are people who never heard of our infamous net.kooks like Tim Rue, Samface, shawn, amigammc or Steve Giovanella).
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 57 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by strobe on 23-Sep-2002 18:37 GMT
I'm a bit suspect of this whole x86 emulation thingy.
Open Firmware allows you to embed a driver in the video/disk controller/whatever card so you don't have to follow crap like VESA. I also don't believe this will lead to cheaper cards since drivers for such cards will have to use a manufacturer's spec in which case you'll be able to flash the Open Firmware ROM anyway just like you can do with the Radeon 8500 and the NVidia gx2mx/gf3/gf4mx/gf4ti/etc.
There aren't enough details here for sure |-\
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 58 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 23-Sep-2002 18:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 57 (strobe):
This system is well tested and it works. Pegasos' BIOS has it too.
It actually emulates a x86 to run the menufacturer specific vesa drivers
in order to have a display BEFORE the native driver is loaded, to display
the bios setup screen, etc.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 59 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by cOrpse on 23-Sep-2002 19:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 56 (mensa):
lol. you make my chuckle.
Get bent btw ;)
- cOrpse
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 60 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by CodeSmith on 23-Sep-2002 19:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 49 (Björn Hagström):
Right, and according to Ole-Egil,
"The XE is EXCACTLY the same as the SE except for the CPU module."
so if the SE does not support DDR, neither will the XE (same northbridge chips). So that's one difference between the A1G3 and a powermac then - the mac supports DDR. This means that the XE won't 'cripple' a G4 (since the CPU itself - according to Ole-Egil - doesn't use it). My guess is then, powermacs use DDR memory because of all the memory-bandwidth-intensive things you're supposed to be able to do with them (direct to disk recording, etc). Gotcha - I learned something today :)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 61 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 23-Sep-2002 20:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 52 (Ridiculous!):
Wrong!! According to Morph's own website, early 1998.
MorphOS Project Announcement
Thursday, 23rd December 1999
....Research for this project started in early 1998, while at the end of 1998
an early implementation was ready. In 1999, we started on the virtual
amiga emulation to make the current AmigaOS available without requiring 68K
hardware. The basic design goals behind MorphOS are....
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 62 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Sigbjørn Skjæret on 23-Sep-2002 20:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 45 (samface):
That LAME (you don't know how right you are... ;) ) person was me, which one was you? The one turning his back in furious anger? ;)
..anyway, I never post anonymously, and you are twisting my words here, all I said was that ainc has delivered exactly zilch for the Amiga market since they took over, and all they seem good at is taking your money without giving anything back (or have you gotten your $50 t-shirts yet?)...
Also, unless you noticed, it was blatant flamebait (you should know how that sounds/looks like) from my side (which makes this post it also I guess, so feel free to ignore it), I just wanted to kill a totally pointless discussion (and I succeeded) that was going nowhere... ;)
- CISC
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 63 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by MIKE on 23-Sep-2002 20:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 56 (mensa):
Tim Rue is intelligent, he's just mentally unstable, but intelligent, a different class then the other fellows you mention, the others you mentioned are nieve at best, or mildly retarded as you hypothesized.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 64 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 23-Sep-2002 21:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 62 (Sigbjørn Skjæret):
>I said was that ainc has delivered exactly zilch for the Amiga market since
>they took over
How can you say that?
Since Bill took over...
We've had OS3.9 released
We have the AmigaDE attracting the attention of some very high profile companies and being shipped pre-installed on products (such as the Sendo cellphones)
We have Amiga OS4 mere weeks away from completion
We have new Amiga computers in the hands of developers and also weeks away from public release
And all this in only 2 and a bit years. In the eight years prior to this we had zilch apart from a minor update to OS3.1 (OS3.5 - thanks Petro).
Amino is the best thing to happen to the Amiga since C= died. You critics should be bowing down before Mr McEwen in gratitude. (Or are you afraid that if you bend down a certain Herr Schmidt will take advantage of your position ;)?
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 65 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 23-Sep-2002 21:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 64 (Anonymous):
* We've had OS3.9 released
A 3rd party finished this product. New versions of MacOS shipped too
* We have the AmigaDE attracting the attention of some very high profile companies and being shipped pre-installed on products (such as the Sendo cellphones)
No-one has shipped AmigaDE. The Sendo Z100 is still vapour.
* We have Amiga OS4 mere weeks away from completion
Amiga OS4 is developed entirely by 3rd parties and is still months away
* We have new Amiga computers in the hands of developers and also weeks away from public release
A few dozen people have test boards from a 3rd party ordered in March.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 66 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 00:43 GMT
In reply to Comment 54 (Elektro):
It has DDR support for the L3 cache. ;-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 67 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 00:58 GMT
In reply to Comment 56 (mensa):
Too true! Just don't feed the trolls, we had a nice discussion before samface
and it is very good to see the new thing take shape finally. Come on, let's
start some common momentum again (Amiga _and_ weirdo föreign board)! :-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 68 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 01:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 60 (CodeSmith):
>This means that the XE won't 'cripple' a G4 (since the CPU itself - according to Ole-Egil - doesn't use it).
True, BUT the current Articia chip cannot use the more efficient MPX busprotocol of G4 either.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 69 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by CodeSmith on 24-Sep-2002 02:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 68 (Anonymous):
MPX derives most of its power from being an asynchronous protocol. This makes it great for multi-cpu systems, but I'm not sure if the price/performance ratio would be as good for single-proc (remember, they're trying to keep prices down - this low-run mobo is expensive enough as it is). I have no idea what the prices are, but I'm pretty sure that Eyetech asked Tundra and Motorola as well as MAI before settling on the Articia northbridge. Also, IIRC no-one outside of Apple makes northbridge chips that support both MPX and AGP. So we're kinda stuck with the choice - and I'd rather have AGP, thank you :)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 70 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by CodeSmith on 24-Sep-2002 02:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 69 (CodeSmith):
Another thing - both bplan and eyetech decided to use the Articia chipset independently (no, I don't think industrial espionage was involved ;). This must mean it's got a pretty good price/performance ratio, even if it's missing a few high-end features. Eyetech was originally going to got for G3 only (G4 being planned for a later mobo), but bplan has been marketing G4-capability from day 1.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 71 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 03:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 70 (CodeSmith):
>but I'm not sure if the price/performance ratio would be as good for single-proc
What do you mean? The price of development at MAI?
>I have no idea what the prices are
25-30USD for the chip afaik, very decent.
>Also, IIRC no-one outside of Apple makes northbridge chips that support both MPX and AGP
Yes.
>both bplan and eyetech decided to use the Articia chipset independently
Eyetech only after the MAI boards were announced, bplan had an own redesigned board many
months earlier already (the two ZIF socket thing). I think that's why they have been so
secretive about their northbridge. :-)
>even if it's missing a few high-end features.
Articia Sa or P, anyone? :)
>Eyetech was originally going to got for G3 only (G4 being planned for a later mobo),
This only shows Eyetech had no plan at that time with the whole BS talking about an
expensive BGA socket or MPC7440-700...
>but bplan has been marketing G4-capability from day 1.
Rarely seen such a good-looking board.
We still wait for that 2+GHz G5 CPU-card (<-> bplan flyer) - come on, guys! :-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 72 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Ole-Egil on 24-Sep-2002 05:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 71 (Anonymous):
The Articia Sa or P aren't ready yet. Unfortunately. But when they come, I'm sure someone will complain about lack of something or the other. There's no pleasing everyone.
Ole-Egil, reading ppcboot docs and ppc assembly like a madman...
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 73 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by CodeSmith on 24-Sep-2002 05:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 72 (Ole-Egil):
Hey, come on! this is the Amiga scene. If you want people to agree with each other or (shock! horror!) hold civilized discussions, pick another platform!
;)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 74 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Gunne Steen on 24-Sep-2002 05:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 51 (Anders Kjeldsen):
We didn't get any board in time for the show, so couldn't sell any there.
Anyway, I don't like to discuss such a things here.
Cheers
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 75 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Gunne Steen on 24-Sep-2002 05:58 GMT
In reply to Comment 72 (Ole-Egil):
Keep up the good work :-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 76 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 06:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (cOrpse):
Afaik it is not illegal around here and I dont care what its like in the USA. Mind you, in the case of Macos and Pegasos Im not interested in either.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 77 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Ridiculous! on 24-Sep-2002 08:31 GMT
In reply to Comment 61 (Anonymous):
"Wrong!! According to Morph's own website, early 1998."
That's when they started development. But how can anyone wait 4-5 years for something which was announced not before 2 years ago ? I stay by my comment. This claim was ridiculous!
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 78 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 24-Sep-2002 09:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 71 (Anonymous):
Titan flyier actually, if it's the one I think it is:)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 79 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 24-Sep-2002 13:33 GMT
In reply to Comment 52 (Ridiculous!):
"Errm... MorphOS was announced in 2000 for the first time. 1997? Come one..."
From http://www.morphos.de:
MorphOS Project Announcement
Thursday, 23rd December 1999
Today we announce the availability of a new Amiga next generation PowerPC
OS project, called MorphOS, to the public.
In its current state it provides a modern memory protection microkernel
which runs a virtual amiga emulation. This microkernel will be the base
for a new OS layer.
Research for this project started in early 1998, while at the end of 1998
an early implementation was ready.
End Quote.
Sorry, it was 1998, not 1997. Now where did you get that 2000 from?
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 80 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 24-Sep-2002 13:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 77 (Ridiculous!):
"That's when they started development."
Yes, and when did AmigaOS4 development start? 2 years later. *My* point stands; it's ridiculous of MorphOS fanatics to claim that the AmigaOS4 has taken so long.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 81 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 24-Sep-2002 13:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 80 (samface):
Sorry, it was even 3 years later. Hyperion started AmigaOS4 development in the end of 2001.
Anyway, stop looking at the numbers and see the point I'm trying to make, ok?
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 82 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Kronos on 24-Sep-2002 13:59 GMT
In reply to Comment 81 (samface):
I don't remember R.S. claiming that he could do it in 3 months.....
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 83 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 24-Sep-2002 14:02 GMT
In reply to Comment 65 (Anonymous):
So what if it's made by third parties? For christ sake, it's still them who are hiring those third parties and making all this possible. What are you whining about anyway? I'm pretty sure MorphOS isn't made 100% in-house either, it's simply the way business works these days.
*sigh*
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 84 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 24-Sep-2002 14:05 GMT
In reply to Comment 82 (Kronos):
And neither did Ben Hermans. You're point beeing? Well, I already know the answer, the broken promises. Well, pooor you, buuhuu.
Face it, broken promises due to unexpected events is nothing new in this industry, get over it.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 85 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Kronos on 24-Sep-2002 14:08 GMT
In reply to Comment 84 (samface):
Well Ben DID announce for february 01, for may 01 and now for december 01.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 86 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 15:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 83 (samface):
You claim that AInc made these things happen, and that it means AInc are contributing great things to the Amiga community, but you offer no evidence at all. If Amiga Inc. employees had done the work then that would be substantial evidence, if Amiga Inc. were putting up hard currency to pay for the work, that too would be substantial evidence. What I see are unsupported claims.
Most of your claims I dismissed by pointing out that they were (in typical Bill McEwen fashion) claims made now about things to be delivered in the future. The AmigaDE remains an unfinished pilot project. Sendo's phone isn't on sale. AOS 4 isn't on sale. The A1G3 isn't on sale. Bill says they'll be ready soon, but he said that about the A1 in 2000!
Promises are worthless. I can't plug a PPC CPU into a promise, I can't run software on promises, and I definitely won't be throwing out my Nokia to use a promise instead. Bill's promises are no better than anyone's lies.
In fact Hyperion and Eyetech are funding their work themselves. They could have done this in 1999 without Bill McEwen even hearing about it. Their work is important (if you want a new Amiga OS and a relatively modern PPC computer) but it's not so different from the work that brought you OS 3.5 and PPC accelerator boards.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 87 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 15:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 84 (samface):
Actually Ben offered a lot of dates until it got to summer and he realised that no matter how often he said "It's 90% done" there was still more than 50% of the work left to be done...
Initial predictions were for February 2002. It's in black and white, no arguments.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 88 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 24-Sep-2002 15:51 GMT
In reply to Comment 87 (Anonymous):
Well. I was never any good at fractions either .. Of that I'm 90% sure.. The other 20% is of two minds.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 89 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Kronos on 24-Sep-2002 15:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 88 (Anonymous):
"The 1st 90% are fun, the 2nd 90% are hard work but the 3rd 90% are hell."
Now guess whom I'm quoting ! (out of memory, so don't count on exact wording).
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 90 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 24-Sep-2002 15:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 87 (Anonymous):
"Actually Ben offered a lot of dates until it got to summer and he realised that no matter how often he said
"It's 90% done" there was still more than 50% of the work left to be
done... "
It's easy to mock him for this, but it happens with most software
development. My theory is that only an insane optimist would start a
large software project.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 91 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by anarchic_teapot on 24-Sep-2002 18:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 85 (Kronos):
Kronos:
"Well Ben DID announce for february 01, for may 01 and now for december 01."
You meant 2002, and yes, he did.
Trouble is, you're once again being deliberately one-sided. Now why don't you complete the picture and enumerate all the dates the bPlan/MOS consortium have also given us for 2002?
:-D
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 92 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 24-Sep-2002 19:43 GMT
In reply to Comment 91 (anarchic_teapot):
Yes...
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 93 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Johan Rönnblom on 24-Sep-2002 21:54 GMT
Saying that Mac on Linux was shown as a selling point for Pegasos
despite possible legal troubles is twisting the truth!
I was there, and there was a discussion about the legal issues, and it
should be quite clear to everyone attending that this possibility
depends on whether the Apple EULA is valid or not.
No matter whether it's valid, I think it's wrong. And if it's legally
invalid, I think it would be a good thing to make people break it. So
I hope that it will be found out that it is wrong, and that people
will be able to use MacOS and MacOS applications on other hardware
such as the A1 or Pegasos.
To Troels E: How did you manage to crash a MorphOS machine if you
didn't attend the MorphOS presentation?-)
It didn't crash at any time during the presentation even though I ran
AmigaAMP/mp3 (68k+PowerUP), AMP2/mpg (WarpUP(tm)) and FroggerNG/mpg
(MorphOS) at the same time. I know I should have brought some divx to
play but the point was actually to illustrate the high level of
compatibility that has already been achieved.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 94 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Troels E on 24-Sep-2002 22:48 GMT
In reply to Comment 93 (Johan Rönnblom):
I was in Gothenborg with a friend both saturday and sunday, we where only there for the AmigaOne presentation but decided to stay to see Gothenborg on a saturday night... And to see the morphos/pegasos presentation next day.
We came a bit early and after playing around with the Pegasos machines we decided that we didn't wan't to wait for the real presentation to begin but rather wanted to return to Denmark..
I don't know why it crashed but I was only running ImageFX at that time and a reboot was needed when the machine froze totally.
Guess it's just a special Morphos feature ;-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 95 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 25-Sep-2002 06:29 GMT
In reply to Comment 94 (Troels E):
"I don't know why it crashed but I was only running ImageFX at that time and a reboot was needed when the
machine froze totally. "
ImageFX has always been a rather buggy program. This may well have
been an ImageFX bug, not a MorphOS problem.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 96 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Ole-Egil on 25-Sep-2002 08:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 95 (Don Cox):
If the application crashes and burns, blame the application. If the whole system freezes up, blaming only the application is rather silly. I mean, during all these years of development of MOS one would think an application wouldn't be allowed to lock up the whole system, right? ;-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 97 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Martin Blom on 25-Sep-2002 08:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 96 (Ole-Egil):
... and after all these years, one would expect an Amiga user to know that it's dead easy for an out-of-control application to crash the OS.
If all sides could just refrain from trolling, this would be such a nice place.
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 98 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Björn Hagström on 25-Sep-2002 09:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 96 (Ole-Egil):
We all know that the way AOS (where MOS,AROS and OS4 has its roots) is designed makes it hard to protect the OS from application making havoc of the memory space. I'm not in favor of MOS in any way, but this can happen in AOS4 as well.
But I assume you already knew that.
/Björn
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 99 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Ole-Egil on 25-Sep-2002 09:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 97 (Martin Blom):
Personally, I haven't used MOS. I haven't seen ANY feature lists either. I have only seen a LOT of shit about the superiority of MOS of AOS. So, what'll it be. Is it a completely new system with only an emulator running AOS applications, or is it just a port of AOS3.1 to ppc using the original sources?
Come on, everyone who has used Unix know that an application can NOT crash the whole OS. Everone who has used Windows NT knows that an application can NOT crash the whole OS. Everyone who has used AmigaOS knows that you are indeed right, as long as "OS" refers to "AmigaOS". This is excactly why I'm constantly complaining about the lack of feature lists of MorphOS. I now know enough about AOS4 to say that I will indeed buy it when it is released. This is thanks to feature lists. Thendic claim to have MOS ready for sale any day now, but since they haven't been willing to tell me ANYTHING about MOS, I cannot even consider buying it yet.
And don't give me any crap about how they are busy coding instead of talking. When you have implemented a feature or at least defined how it will work, writing one lousy sentence about it doesn't hurt the rest of the development.
I realize that www.morphos.de has a list of "design goals", but I am unable to find any info as to what features will make it into which versions. For instance SMP or memory protection. In 1.0 released this year, or not? Yes or no will suffice. ;-)
News from AmiGbg Fall event (from Amga.org) : Comment 100 of 120ANN.lu
Posted by Ole-Egil on 25-Sep-2002 09:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 98 (Björn Hagström):
But that's the whole point. According to those who claim to know, MOS is NOT based on AOS. It's using a completely new kernel and only running AOS applications in an emulated environment, for Christines sakes. So if no original sources has been used and the only thing that has ANYTHING to do with AOS in MOS is the emulated environment, why should ImageFX crash MOS? See my point? ;-)
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