24-Apr-2024 12:12 GMT.
UNDER CONSTRUCTION
Anonymous, there are 19 items in your selection
[Rant] Is this it?ANN.lu
Posted on 07-Dec-2002 04:26 GMT by JoannaK19 comments
View flat
View list
My conclusion of current situation published for open discussion here in Ann.lu. Extracted (+ couple typos fixed) from my public letter to one of companies now involved into this. (Type: Rant, but not flaming) (conclusion.. )

In the end.. this Amiga situation is all Controlling Game. Like You have admitted and like all others have said one way or another during their talks... You can all work together as long as 'Insert our favorite person/corporation' is in the LEAD. Only way to make this end seems to be that there has to be ONE company (or team) that crushes all competition and makes them paying slaves.

Correct me if I'm wrong here. I see this all as divorcing parent's fighting from their children . Every lie is acceptable, every method is legal as long as you can assure to have all us on your side. I do understand we are talking about remarkable markets here, especially IF by some accident winner happens to create real and attractive product to make this all happen in a way winner can lure all Ex users back.

Sorry. Only thing I can see is that people with best liars (and perhaps even lawyers), most money and (hopefully one day) best product wins this game. During these years there would have been plenty of times to you *great leaders* to get together but each time someone has wanted to have upper edge to others, so it have not become anything more constructive than ongoing bickering, fighting and Mud throwing.

Have well.. And remember all to have plenty of Mud around.

Joanna Kurki
Long Time EX Amiga user, EX Commodore developer etc etc..

Is this it? : Comment 1 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by cheesegrate on 07-Dec-2002 06:08 GMT
i agree, if there's nothing than one cult, it's several fighting for the same brainwashed followers..
Is this it? : Comment 2 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by m0ns00n on 07-Dec-2002 09:05 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (cheesegrate):
I agree. And for me it was one of the reasons to learn Linux, so that they could fight as long as they wanted to, and I can stay productive. Even though, in my eyes, this whole affair have been tiring, I think Gensi is the only company to have shown willingness to cooperate, at least publicly. They have been, as mentined on Morphos-news, real community aware, more so than Amiga Inc has lately. I have gotten more than one email from them out of their own initiative, asking me what I would like to see in their products, and this is more a sign of intrest in the community that the "high priests" in Washington have shown. Amiga Inc has all but totally wanished from the community scene.
On top of this, Amiga Inc themselves have not managed to pull one interesting product out of their pocket. If one thinks back on the "screenshots" from AmigaOS 5 (the blue themed desktop with lots of features shown), one can see how Amiga Inc has gone from "interesting to boring". Amiga DE is in my opinion just a flaw, as we all know, if one has studied the progress of Sun, how far Java is coming. I have already run LOTS of "write once, run everywhere" java apps (limewire anyone?). And they run fast. Why would I need DE.
Amiga Inc and their band should cooperate with Gensi, and Gensi the other way around. And they have to work together to make a great product. If now, I think that the whole Amiga concept will fade away.
Is this it? : Comment 3 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by m0ns00n on 07-Dec-2002 09:06 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (m0ns00n):
If now..If not.
Is this it? : Comment 4 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by catohagen on 07-Dec-2002 09:25 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (m0ns00n):
maybe.....there is no marked left to earn a living from....maybe Amiga Inc
have a chance to, as little as it may seem, stay alive and have some income
of the AmigaDE/Amiga Anywhere.
Seeing that pegasos only sold around ~200 to amiga community and there rest of
the 1000 boards to linux users, the chances for making a living of Amiga
as a computer/OS aint looking too good...
You can't blaim Amiga Inc. of calculating this risk, and play with as many
cards as they can...the Amiga DE have/or should have a good chance in the
handheld/stb/mobile marked.....
Is this it? : Comment 5 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 07-Dec-2002 11:27 GMT
How on earth can anyone assume morphos and AmigaOS can work together? Two entirely different designs, there is nothing to win by cooperating, and every customer of one is a direct loss of the other.
The situation is a bit different for pegasos and amigaone boards but not much. The boards would both profit from being able to run both OSs but thats not going to happen because both have strong bonds to one OS.
Additionally on one side there already is cooperation - any new party would have to agree to the rules that are set in place and not insist on bringing new ones while breaking old.
Is this it? : Comment 6 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 07-Dec-2002 11:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (m0ns00n):
> Why would I need DE.
The reality is noone cares why you (a customer) need a product. The reality is that Java is too big for the small devices, where VP (Intent/AmigaDE) is not - and VP can run java apps almost at native speeds (they are compiled to VP and then again compiled to the specific platform when run).
There is reason for companies to use such a product no matter if you or even a majority of all people arent interested.
The bonus is that AmigaDE is scalable (Intent is only meant for emedded devices).
AmigaOS/DE X written entirely in VP could run on any existing hardware out of the box - THAT is a vision!
Is this it? : Comment 7 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 07-Dec-2002 12:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Anonymous):
"AmigaOS/DE X written entirely in VP could run on any existing hardware out of the box - THAT is a
vision! "
I doubt that, as the DE doesn't run on Amigas or Macs now. It appears
that supporting new platforms on Tao's system is a much bigger job
than they claim.
Is this it? : Comment 8 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Lawd on 07-Dec-2002 15:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Anonymous):
> The reality is that Java is too big for the small devices,
The AmigaDE does not exist. Maybe it will some day, who knows, but right now all that has appeared is the AACE ("DE player"). That runs as an application on top of full-fledged mobile operating systems, and all of them already include JVMs.
> AmigaOS/DE X written entirely in VP could run on any existing hardware out of
> the box - THAT is a vision!
A desktop OS based on "AmigaDE" was a crack pipe dream that ainc has been rudely awakened from by the very people who deliver the foundation for their DE stuff - Tao. That's all old news.
Besides, you'd need a PII/CII written for each platform, not to mention an "Amiga licensed" vendor for the hardware, who'd bundle the OS... You wouldn't want all those evil pirates out there to actually buy the OS and run it on "any" hardware, would you?
Ainc is FUBAR and has no vision beyond selling peoples' puzzle games for MS devices, and licensing trademarks to the cesspool known as "the Amiga market".
Is this it? : Comment 9 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by John Block on 07-Dec-2002 15:16 GMT
My amigaone g4 board is on pre order.
Simply, I've been waiting on a new amiga with amigaos and this solution is built on the foundations which I like.
My preference would have been to again have a system under 500 pounds that beats everything else
My second preference would have been a Dell deal running amigaos nativly on nice but reasonablly priced hardware.
The amigaone will run amigaos, hopefully 4, faster if only under emulation, if there's no progress it will run linux, mac on linux, and possibly windows under emulation.
I'm having the system built rather than overpaying for a prebuilt one, so unlikly worse case: half my investment (the board) is written off, and the parts go into a pc.
Is this it? : Comment 10 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Alan on 07-Dec-2002 16:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Anonymous):
I agree! I do not see morphOS offering any vision other then what is already established by microsoft and Mac and evern Linux. What do they offer? At leats AmigaOS and its eventual evolution, DE, has a vision; reinvent the desktop OS and the computer environment. And reinvention is not just another pretty desktop but goes deeper into the OS as DE will (if the original plans are still in place).
Is this it? : Comment 11 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by gary_c on 07-Dec-2002 17:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (Anonymous):
> The reality is that Java is too big for the small devices, where VP (Intent/AmigaDE) is not
The reality is that Java is running on cell phones in Japan now and, I assume, other places too. How small were you talking about? :-)
-- gary_c
Is this it? : Comment 12 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Daniel Miller on 07-Dec-2002 17:57 GMT
In reply to Comment 10 (Alan):
Alan typed:
> I agree! I do not see morphOS offering any vision other then what is already
> established by microsoft and Mac and evern Linux. What do they offer?
The Eclipsis is a handheld device projected to run MorphOS, so Genesi intends
to offer a mobile computing solution. I gather the Eclipsis is intended to be
"dockable" on a Pegasos, so you could synchronize your data etc. Genesi also
has plans relating to smartcards with memory chips for various uses, such as
identification, banking, shopping, and gaming.
The Pegasos (which is debuting in consumer release version this weekend) is
planned to be offered in four themes: Pegashush silent home server,
VideoMicrowave multimedia processing terminal, a gaming system, and... well
I forget the other one right now. ;)
So that is what they intend to offer, the vision which you are asking about.
Is this it? : Comment 13 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Teemu I. Yliselä on 07-Dec-2002 18:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 11 (gary_c):
Yeah, several manufacturers have had Java-enabled phones shipping in Europe for months. Some pretty cheap models too. I suppose Java could become a rather standard feature in cell phones in the future. At least Nokia seems to be aggressively pushing Java.
Is this it? : Comment 14 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Janne Sirén on 07-Dec-2002 18:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 11 (gary_c):
>> The reality is that Java is too big for the small devices, where VP
>(Intent/AmigaDE) is not
>The reality is that Java is running on cell phones in Japan now and, I
>assume, other places too. How small were you talking about? :-)
I have three Nokia cell-phones capable of running Java here in Finland. They are all sold in Europe and are available for immediate purchase. One of those, the Nokia 9210 Communicator, has been for sale for a year and a hald. The other, the Nokia 3410, is a small, cheap, black and white basic phone and has been for sale since last summer. It runs Java amazingly well, and comes with a 3D game. The 7650, a colour smartphone with a camera, has been for sale about the same time as well.
The mobile phone operators here have been selling Java content for mobile phones via SMS/WAP since the summer. I can buy Java games for my cell-phones for a few euros right away. I just send an SMS and the phone downloads the content. Easy and works. I have a lovery version of Lode Runner for my 7650 here. Very neat. Not soon, not in two weeks. Today. And for six months already. And for a full year prior to that I was running Java content on a 9210 cell-phone.
Look, the fact of the matter is: Java is here. It has been here for years, and it has been here for mobile devices for a relatively long time already as well.
I have no comment on AmigaDE.
Is this it? : Comment 15 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by KenH on 07-Dec-2002 18:51 GMT
In reply to Comment 8 (Lawd):
Mmmm...yes that's why they are sanctioning the development of OS4.
>Ainc is FUBAR and has no vision beyond selling peoples' puzzle games for MS devices, and licensing trademarks to the cesspool known as "the Amiga market".
Is this it? : Comment 16 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 08-Dec-2002 10:29 GMT
Nice... JoannaK provocates it (Alan answers on Yahoo), and then comes here to whine.
Is this it? : Comment 17 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by JoannaK on 08-Dec-2002 18:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 16 (Anonymous):
I don't pointin to him or anyone in this in specially allthough it's from open mail to him that I extractec that part. All have said the same..
"get rid of that XXX and we talk Peace.. " .. it's all the same all around.
GO ask yoursel if you don't belive me. I'm bored to these people who can make promices but don't deliver. And I'm bored to anonymous cowards..
Is this it? : Comment 18 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Akaru on 09-Dec-2002 07:10 GMT
Unfortunately it only takes 1 or 2 companys with lousy business ethics to screw up a market as small as this one. The Amiga Market appears to have no shortage of them.
I think the problem is that the Amiga Market still has several thousand complete idiots willing to be taken for a ride by anyone who will pay them lip service, and for a con man thats plenty to make a living out of.
Is this it? : Comment 19 of 19ANN.lu
Posted by Jope on 09-Dec-2002 07:33 GMT
I guess this is likely to be it for me too..
I'm not going for the new machines, even though I lost $50 in the voucher offer. (still no t-shirt)
I'll never get rid of my A4000, though.. Maybe I'll even cave in and get a PCI expansion for it. I still use my Amigas, but I don't really have a problem with other platforms either. I have PCs, Amigas, HP-PA stuff, an RS/6000, lots of CBM 8-bits.. What's the big problem. :-)
The New Amigas aren't really what I want in my Amiga. In my opinion, Amithlon/Umilator was exactly what was needed. The key here is commodity hardware, at maximum speed available, with the best price/power ratio. In order to get the much wanted ex-users back, you don't make them buy 700e worth of hardware that's slower, than what they could have gotten for that 700e. Many have migrated to x86 and Linux. Amithlon / Umilator would have been an excellent choice. Cheap, installs nicely alongside your normal OS, does a good job of running Amiga stuff and has the ability to run x86 native Amiga code as well!
Dual booting doesn't kill an OS, it's the lack of app support. If you don't get enough apps to be able to stop dual booting to your old OS, you'll quickly stop booting back to the alternate OS and the OS that does the most without reboots will become the default..
What I'd like to see is MOS or OS4 to be hardware independent in the Linux sense, even if it is going to be PPC only.. I'd *love* to have my RS/6000 running MOS or OS4. That would have a big coolness factor AND I already have the hardware. Make it run on the Macs as well! Many ex Amigans migrated over there too, they already have the PPC hardware.
This, however leads us to another problem that is a rather difficult one: who will provide the myriad of drivers and support? They can't scavenge Linux for them, I guess, unless they make the drivers open source as well.. This of course is not an option, I've seen. (several different Classic PCI implementations spring to mind) :-(
Anonymous, there are 19 items in your selection
Back to Top