| [Rant] "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? | ANN.lu |
| Posted on 25-Dec-2002 12:19 GMT by P E | 220 comments
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Over at amiga.org, the signature "takemehomegrandma" has published a somewhat satirical post - for your enjoyment, here goes:
I want to apologize that the AmigaOne has still not been released (A1 mobos+OS4). I also want to apologize to our competing companies that we have accused for crimes in public without being able to back those accusations up with either proof or legal action. I also want to apologize for not keeping our promises to you developers who bought our expensive SDK's. I also want to apologize to the users who bought our coupons, ehrm, JOINED OUR CLUB, but has not been given anything of the promised. I also want to apologize for the confusion when our offices suddenly were empty and our phones went dead (but that was a result of hackers, remember). Amiga Inc is truly a global 24 hours a day company and the future looks brighter than ever for our beloved AMIGA. We are pleased to announce a Games Pocket Pack to our friends Micro$ofts Pocket PC. This truly shows what a great commitment our 3000 content developers has to our beloved AMIGA. Wonderful things are about to happen as allways. Thank you, as allways, for your support. Keep the AMIGA spirit, and remember to follow our trademark wherever we go. We are AMIGA. You are AMIGA (if you pay us 50 bucks). We will be back with more exciting announcements during the next weeks. See you then! /Yours McBill
Well, there you go. Merry christmas!
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 151 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Don Cox on 27-Dec-2002 08:23 GMT | In reply to Comment 111 (Alkemyst):
"There are more MOS supporters speaking here than AmigaOS supporters."
That's not surprising considering the Pegasos/MorphOS is on sale and
is supported by a major publicity campaign, while those who would
prefer an AmigaOne/AOS 4 are waiting for the product to be released.
The "MOS people" are in a position to crow. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 152 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Alkemyst on 27-Dec-2002 08:26 GMT | In reply to Comment 149 (Christian Kemp):
The comment you were replying to was simple.
I was talking about members & your reply was nothing to do with that. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 153 of 220 | ANN.lu |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 154 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Alkemyst on 27-Dec-2002 08:33 GMT | In reply to Comment 151 (Don Cox):
Nice one Don for taking my comment out of context.
& with stuff going on like that all the time no wonder AmigaOs4 & Aone supporters stop posting here.
cos no matter what they say its ok for MOS ppl to hammer them down not matter what the topic cos its MOS/Pegasos is on sale now.
The fact that MOS/Pegasos is on sale now was not the issue but your trying to make it so.
I will not waste my time with you or any other person twisting words or taking my comments out of conntext.
Cos ppl can just keep doing that for ever. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 155 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by RPM on 27-Dec-2002 08:46 GMT | In reply to Comment 146 (Frodon):
from dictionary
"Emulator-
hardware or software that permits programs written for one computer to be run
on another usually newer computer"
so if amigaos software runs on it,it must include amigaos emulator or how else would it work?.and yes you can use other words too but its still an emulator. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 156 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Anonymous on 27-Dec-2002 08:59 GMT | In reply to Comment 151 (Don Cox):
> That's not surprising considering the Pegasos/MorphOS is on sale and
> is supported by a major publicity campaign, while those who would
> prefer an AmigaOne/AOS 4 are waiting for the product to be released.
Getting actively into BIG events like this http://www.cesweb.org/exhibitor_dir/eims_exhibitor_details.asp?exhibid=4676&
is really good sign of Genesi activity on pushing their products to wider audience. they are not just trying to keep old fans, they are trying to open all new markets too.
But they have done a LOT more .. and more importantly they have done lots of RIGHT things. Since 1999 there have been NO support from AmigaInc (or their associates) to local (countrywide) Amiga Users Group. No interest to attend our shows (on 2001 well over 300 visiors in single day), no help for demonstrating their producs.. Nothing! OTOH Genesi brought their Coyote Flux team (and Pegasos) to Groups Meeting at Oulu (quite far away place.. 600km away from Capital). Having this REAL new machine for people to try it even though it was (earlier this year) still a bit beta was really and eye-opener.
> The "MOS people" are in a position to crow.
Those who still can think are considering what to do. And being frankly it's not too hard to see which one of these announced PPC-based systems is way ahead. Of course I can't tell what will happen in time, but for those people really looking for usable system to replace (or enchance) their existing (or now defunct) Classic Amigas.. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 157 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by JoannaK on 27-Dec-2002 09:23 GMT | In reply to Comment 156 (Anonymous):
(oops.. forgot my name atop of it.. Sorry) |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 158 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 09:36 GMT | In reply to Comment 155 (RPM):
Hello,
@RPM
Have you read my last post completely?
The "AmigaOS emulation" in the ABox is just a part of it not the all ABox. So it's not an emulator (I mean it's not a correct definition because it doesn't describe what it is exactly just one of its functionnality).
The ABox is an environment box which one of its functionnality is to emulate the AmigaOS environment to be able to run AmigaOS 3.x softwares. But as it also run new softwares (MorphOS PPC Native softwares) it's not just an emulator.
So saying the ABox is an emulator is not ok. Because that imply that the ABox is ONLY an emulator, which is false. The ABox is an environment box and the "AmigaOS 3.x emulation" is just one of its functionnality but not all the ABox.
Regards |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 159 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by RPM on 27-Dec-2002 10:13 GMT | In reply to Comment 158 (Frodon):
So if i were to introduce new Instructions to the 68k emulator it would stop being an 68k emulator? |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 160 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by takemehomegrandma on 27-Dec-2002 10:30 GMT | In reply to Comment 139 (acg):
> and supposedly they [AmigaInc] just are a software company...
IMO, AmigaInc is not even a software company, merely a licensing company. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 161 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by takemehomegrandma on 27-Dec-2002 10:35 GMT | In reply to Comment 147 (Senex (Martin Heine)):
Well said. I second to that! |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 162 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 11:00 GMT | In reply to Comment 158 (Frodon):
hello ? i know if you could change the meaning of the word 'emulator'
you would, but you can't, so just accept it :)
mos runs amiga programs, mos is not amiga nor amigaos, so its an emulator.
it have other features added aswell, but the whole MEANING of abox is
to run amiga programs, in a *non* amigaos environment..thats EMULATING
It doesnt emulate the cpu, but it EMULATES the amiga environment...
morphos gives the amiga programs the same environment, so it will not know
if its in the real amigaos nor morphos, the abox is EMULATING the
real amigaos and the amiga environment.
why do you think its called morphos ? the word morph means something like
to transform or to be transformed |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 163 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Don Cox on 27-Dec-2002 11:35 GMT | In reply to Comment 156 (Anonymous):
"Those who still can think are considering what to do. And being frankly it's not too hard to see which one
of these announced PPC-based systems is way ahead. Of course I can't tell what will happen in time, but
for those people really looking for usable system to replace (or enchance) their existing (or now defunct)
Classic Amigas.. "
Not sure about "way ahead". One is an unfinished OS which can be shown
running, the other is an unfinished OS which cannot be shown running.
But I think this is just because they have different parts missing. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 164 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 27-Dec-2002 12:12 GMT | In reply to Comment 152 (Alkemyst):
You were talking about members on the wrong website :) ANN has no members, only
people that post often. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 165 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 27-Dec-2002 12:14 GMT | In reply to Comment 154 (Alkemyst):
While it was ok to hammer MorphOS at EVERY SINGLE chance, while it was not out,
right? Don't see half the truth. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 166 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 27-Dec-2002 12:17 GMT | In reply to Comment 159 (RPM):
ARGH!
What he tells you is that ONE of A/Box's functions is emulation, it does MANY
other stuff as well. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 167 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 27-Dec-2002 12:20 GMT | In reply to Comment 162 (catohagen):
Morphos is actually the name of the blue butterfly, Morphos Menelaus. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 168 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by takemehomegrandma on 27-Dec-2002 12:21 GMT | In reply to Comment 162 (catohagen):
> mos runs amiga programs, mos is not amiga nor amigaos, so its an emulator.
No. MorphOS is a new OS, written from scratch, based on a microkernel and a "box" design. The Abox is a reimplementation of AmigaOS, thus it uses the Amiga API but the code behind the API is written from scratch in PPC. So MorphOS is an alternative AmigaOS distribution (native) and not an emulator. Emulation has nothing to do with brand names, no matter how much you would like to think so.
> it have other features added aswell, but the whole MEANING of abox is
> to run amiga programs, in a *non* amigaos environment..thats EMULATING
The Abox *IS* an AmigaOS envireonment, but without the Amiga(tm) brand. So it's *not* emulating.
> It doesnt emulate the cpu, but it EMULATES the amiga environment...
There is CPU emulation for the 68k processor, but the Amiga envireonment is there natively through the Amiga API and the native MorphOS Abox functions behind it. I think you are again confusing emulation with trademarks.
> morphos gives the amiga programs the same environment, so it will not know
> if its in the real amigaos nor morphos, the abox is EMULATING the
> real amigaos and the amiga environment.
Read above! BTW, do you realize that the same thing will be the case for AmigaOS4? The OS4 gives the Amiga programs the same envireonment as before, so they will not know if it's the 68k AmigaOS3.1 or the PPC OS4. So in your definition of emulation, the OS4 will be an AmigaOS emulator? Or is emulation all about branding and trademarks in your opinion?
In fact, there will be even more of emulation in OS4, since parts of it won't even be in PPC and therefore parts of the OS itself will be run through the 68k emulator. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 169 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 12:34 GMT | In reply to Comment 168 (takemehomegrandma):
look at post by Alkis :
>What he tells you is that ONE of A/Box's functions is emulation, it does MANY
>other stuff as well.
it does many other stuff as well, but its emulating the an alien os ontop
of mos kernel, so its an emulator too :) |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 170 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Daniel Miller on 27-Dec-2002 12:37 GMT | I groaned when I first saw this article, because it looked like something
designed to rile up a certain element of the community and cause bickering. But
the article from takemehomegrandma was completely removed from its context on
amiga.org by the anonymous person who put it on ANN (to cause bickering IMO).
The context was that someone had started a thread on "Where is Bill McEwen's
Christmas Announcement" and that was when tmhg stuck in this parody, as one
post among many. Here on ANN it looks like tmhg uploaded it out of the blue.
You might like this humor or you might not, but if you want to blame someone
for causing flames on ANN on Christmas you should blame the anonymous person. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 171 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 12:48 GMT | In reply to Comment 167 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
its actually morpho menelaus :) and why did it get its name ?
its wings are covered with shells and have a metallic like surface
to help them camouflage with the surrounding foliage, so you will have a
hard time seeing it as it flies around the forrest.
man, i love google :) |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 172 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 12:50 GMT | In reply to Comment 169 (catohagen):
Hello
@cathoagen
> it does many other stuff as well, but its emulating the an alien os ontop
> of mos kernel, so its an emulator too :)
What I try to tell you and to the others is that by saying the ABox IS an emulator you imply it's the definition of the ABox.
And as I already tell, a definition of something whatever it is should describe the object compeltely just not one aspect. That's why saying the ABox IS an emulator is wrong because it's just one aspect so it CAN'T be used as a definition of this object.
You can indeed say: The ABox emulate the AmigaOS environment. That's true as soon as you use this form you just give one of its function.
But saying the ABox IS an emulator it's wrong because it's far more than that!
It's like if I said: Catohagen IS an eye. Ok you got eyes, but you are not an eye, it's just one of your element.
Do you finally understand? Is it so hard to understand this fondamental aspect, i.e what is a definition?
You know the only thing I've tried to say here in the last few posts is just to recall you what is a definition and so why "ABox is an emulator" is not a good definition :) Maybe I was wrong but I thought this fondamental aspect of a language was known by everybody.
Regards |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 173 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 13:01 GMT | In reply to Comment 170 (Daniel Miller):
yep, blame the moderators :) they could easily removed it for several
reasons, just the fact that the poster wanted to be anonymous speaks the purpose
of posting it....takemehomegrandma made a fun joke, and here its posted
with the headline "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm?
like he doesnt know its real or not...
it could also be removed until takemehomegrandma gives a 'OK' as its
easy to have fun deep into a thread, but posted in the frontpage of a
popular general computer news site, might not be so funny...
but no, the moderators keeps it without asking, as they did with Alan's message
in the amigaone list, even when Alan asks for not to be quoted or reposted
around the net....
They are very kind though with others asking the same, as Kai from Terrasoft
confirming theres no problems with their products(the TeronCx) im just confused
that Alan didnt get the same respect... |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 174 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 13:08 GMT | In reply to Comment 172 (Frodon):
ok, i see.....so Morphos is not an emulator but it emulate the AmigaOS environment.... |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 175 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by JoannaK on 27-Dec-2002 13:11 GMT | In reply to Comment 163 (Don Cox):
" Not sure about "way ahead". One is an unfinished OS which can be shown
running, the other is an unfinished OS which cannot be shown running.
But I think this is just because they have different parts missing."
I really would like to know what those critical parts OS4 is missing. And what is more or less honest ETA for their arrival? ..
I know this question may sound a bit hostile (and boring) but I have been years wihout any kind of working Amigaish system since death of Beos (it was Amigaish enough to be nice to use..). So waiting unannouced amount of months ain't too fun anymore.
I have not used MOS myself but what I have gathered it's extremely close on what I could consider usable state. Ok, there are some parts still missing like native Arexx (and Java, een though I don't care about Java at all) but I do have legal version of Arexx so it's not problem cause 68k version works well enough. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 176 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 13:12 GMT | In reply to Comment 174 (catohagen):
Hello,
Well not MorphOS, the ABox. MorphOS is an OS, the ABox is an environment box which, between other things, *emulate* the AmigaOS environment but it also offer new APIs which were not available on the AmigaOS and allow to make MorphOS ABox specific softwares which will use this new functionnalities and will be PPC native.
Regards |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 177 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Christian Kemp on 27-Dec-2002 13:15 GMT | In reply to Comment 173 (catohagen):
Alan posted to a mailing list that is freely accessible via a web frontend. Kai sent a confidential personal mail. There is a large difference between the two. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 178 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Navvie on 27-Dec-2002 13:40 GMT | | Heh, nice. Very amusing. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 179 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 13:46 GMT | In reply to Comment 177 (Christian Kemp):
ok, but whats the point of adding this text in the signature of your email
program ? :
This email and the information it contains are a confidential and privileged ?
communication for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). Any ?
unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you ?
have received this message and are not the intended recipient(s), ?
please notify the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the ?
original message |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 180 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 13:48 GMT | In reply to Comment 179 (catohagen):
sorry, the '?' in end of every line shouldn't be there.... |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 181 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Christian Kemp on 27-Dec-2002 14:12 GMT | In reply to Comment 179 (catohagen):
You'd have to ask Alan.
But restricting a message that can be freely and openly read by both mailing list subscribers and random visitors on Yahoo.com to "the sole use of the intended recipient" is kinda pointless, since the "intended recipient" can be anyone. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 182 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by RPM on 27-Dec-2002 14:25 GMT | In reply to Comment 166 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
It looks to me that main function of the a/box is to emulate the amigaos erco amigaos emulator. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 183 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 14:36 GMT | In reply to Comment 181 (Christian Kemp):
Alan posted the message to the amigaone list recipients and not to ann.lu,
amiga.org, moobunny, or anyother web site or mailing list.
And he requested the message not reposted or quoted, don't you think if he
thought the message was so important he would post on ann.lu himself ? |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 184 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Don Cox on 27-Dec-2002 14:38 GMT | In reply to Comment 175 (JoannaK):
"I really would like to know what those critical parts OS4 is missing. And what is more or less honest ETA
for their arrival? .. "
Well you see the same information that I do. The last thing I saw was
that they were working on the integration of the 68k emulator
(Petunia), and I haven't seen any announcement that this is now
finished. So I presume the emulator is still being worked on.
Personally, I expect the other pieces to fall into place fairly
quickly once the emulator is fully functioning. I always expected the
emulator would be the hard part.
You may have a different impression? |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 185 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Christian Kemp on 27-Dec-2002 14:50 GMT | In reply to Comment 183 (catohagen):
This discussion is many years old. On Usenet, you can't stop people from copying your message over and over again, link to it, etc. The same should hold true for a open mailing list with web frontend. Alan should know that, and I'd assume so would you.
ANN has been doing this "summarising or linking to interesting stuff that is mentioned elsewhere" thing for six years now, and in fact owes much of its success to it. It's funny that people start to object to it now.
But I guess it's pointless arguing with you, since you seem to have turned into a blind follower and defender of everything that is Amiga Inc or Eyetech... |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 186 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 14:52 GMT | In reply to Comment 182 (RPM):
Hello,
Yes and no. Restricting ABox to just emulation of AmigaOS 3.x would be not very clever. It offer also a good path to port original AmigaOS 68k, WarpUP or PowerUP programs to MorphOS ABox PPC native and offer additional APIs which allow developer to modernize their software as well as porting it.
And emulation of OS 3.x and the new APIs and porting facilities to MorphOS ABox PPC Native are in my opinion at least equally important in the ABox. I would even ssay that the new APIs and PPC Native porting facilities will be more or more important in the future because more and more MorphOS ABox PPC Native software will be available.
So yes at the beginning, because of the transition from a 68k mainly based environment to a full PPC environment, the OS 3.x emulation with the 68k emulator will be more important, of course also the WarpUP compatible layer and PowerUP compatible layer.
But quickly when, as it has already began, more and more software will be ported or directly written for the new ABox PPC Native APIs and ABI the emulation part will not be very useful anymore.
So I would rather say that the main goal of the ABox is to offer a good transition path from the AmigaOS 3.x 68k, WarpUP or PowerUP environment to the MorphOS ABox PPC Native environment. So that people can use new software designed for PPC and MorphOS as well as their old software as soon as they need them. So that they can replace their old software by new ones smoothly when the new ones suit them.
Regards |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 187 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by David Scheibler on 27-Dec-2002 15:00 GMT | In reply to Comment 183 (catohagen):
These "confidential"-statements are nonsense. They are not needed. You are not
allowed to copy *any* message from *anybody* from one forum to another unless
the original poster allowed you to do so. IMHO Alan just copied the disclaimer
from Gary who also really doesn't know what it actually means if he has such a
disclaimer in a public web forum. Those disclaimers may be usefull if you fax
something around to your lawyer, other companies etc. but for email
conversation/webforums they are not needed at all. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 188 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 15:36 GMT | In reply to Comment 185 (Christian Kemp):
You can call me whatever you like, i'm an amiga user :) if being an amiga user
equals being a blind follower and defender, so be it. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 189 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Anonymous on 27-Dec-2002 15:56 GMT | In reply to Comment 188 (catohagen):
There is clearly two kind of "Amiga users", the close-minded Amiga users who are blind followers and defender and use non rational arguments like: "I choose the AmigaOne/OS 4 because it has the Amiga name". They most of the time don't know very much how the AmigaOS works and follow the Amiga name blindly because the only thing they know is that they like the AmigaOS.
And there is the open-minded Amiga users who consider both solutions rationally and try to understand them to decide themselves with a rational point of view. They often use rational arguments and know the both solutions quite well because they've gathered as much information as possible about them. They most of the time are people who know how the AmigaOS work and decide with what they like of the AmigaOS technically speaking.
Of course sometime people who know the AmigaOS very well technicaly speaking are "blind followers" too because they've drunk without checking the FUDs and BS Mr Ben "I'm a lawyer" Hermans have said in the past to discredit MOS. We can also say that they are close-minded.
Now I let you guess in what of this category you are. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 190 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Anonymous on 27-Dec-2002 16:14 GMT | In reply to Comment 187 (David Scheibler):
No they should not be needed BUT it should give a strong hint to those people that dont have a clue. |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 191 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 16:59 GMT | In reply to Comment 189 (Anonymous):
>"I choose the AmigaOne/OS 4 because it has the Amiga name"
I dont see how this is enough reason to choose a product.
For choosing your hw/sw platform you have to look at what it gives you in
form of features and if it gives you what you need.
the OS4 featurelist have been available for a long time, the MOS featurelist
was just recently released, and no information nor hint of features was
given because fear of the features being stolen by Hyperion.
Also seeing that Genesi/thendic is a new company in the amiga marked, the users
have no idea of it still lives in 2 years to forfill its promises and seeing what
happened to other companies Bill Buck have been involved in, it doesnt look
promising...
I based my choise on
1. The makers/porters of the OS have a long amiga history and provider of
hi-quality games, mostly 3d engine based games that are highly optimised
and run at decent speed, considering such old hardware.
Games squeese hardware to its limits, so an OS thats does the same
will kick butt :)
2. The amigaone or teron are made by external company not relying on
amiga sales, so less chance of hardware being unavailable or stopped
from development due to low sales.
3. If Amiga 'the *NAME*' inc goes bust, Hyperion still have the rights to sell
amigaos.
4. The continuation of bullshit and fud spreading by competitors(BBRV) strengthens
my belives that they are afraid of AmigaOne and OS4 and thats its a better product
They have spend alot of money, and none comming in(bill bucks words) and they
need to change that, they think spreading fud and lying about its competitors
will change that.
Terrasoft where parters with thendic, suddenly they sell Teron boards and
Bill Buck again comes with the speach of his life about 'We are being crushed' and
'YDL will crash and burn' |
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| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 192 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 17:16 GMT | In reply to Comment 191 (catohagen):
Hello,
> the OS4 featurelist have been available for a long time, the MOS featurelist
> was just recently released, and no information nor hint of features was
> given because fear of the features being stolen by Hyperion.
Sorry but as far as I could see, the MorphOS feature list is far more complete and contain far more interesting and usefull information to make a choice than the AmigaOS 4 feature list which is a bit too short and not enough detailed IMHO. So read the MorphOS feature list more carefully. Because saying what you say I really wonder if you have looked at it, I mean in its detailled form available in PDF and Text format (cf MorphOS-News.de)
> Also seeing that Genesi/thendic is a new company in the amiga marked, the
> users have no idea of it still lives in 2 years to forfill its promises and
> seeing what happened to other companies Bill Buck have been involved in, it
> doesnt look promising...
Look better, I don't think you've looked at everything in that aspect. Otherwise you won't say that.
And for now as far as I could see, Thendic/BPlan/Genesi have forfill all their promises contrary to Amiga Inc for example. The Pegasos is here and MorphOS too.
Regards |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 193 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 17:30 GMT | In reply to Comment 191 (catohagen):
Hello again,
> 1. The makers/porters of the OS have a long amiga history and provider of
> hi-quality games, mostly 3d engine based games that are highly optimised
> and run at decent speed, considering such old hardware.
> Games squeese hardware to its limits, so an OS thats does the same
> will kick butt :)
Well personnally I think that game development and OS development are two highly different things. I mean that's not because a company is good to make games that this company can make a good OS.
That's why I prefer to not have an opinion on their OS development capacities before I see the result of their work (i.e: AmigaOS 4). I mean it's far from obvious that the fact they make good games imply they make a good OS.
> 2. The amigaone or teron are made by external company not relying on
> amiga sales, so less chance of hardware being unavailable or stopped
> from development due to low sales.
Well ok. But you know the one who really sell AmigaOnes is Eyetech and if you want AmigaOS 4 you need to buy boards from them because there is a dongle. So if Eyetech go wrong there will be no AmigaOnes anymore. Of course it'll then be possible to adapt the TeronCX for AmigaOS 4 or AmigaOS 4 to run on normal TeronCX but in that case the same can be done for MorphOS, i.e it can run on TeronCX/PX also if it'd be needed in the future (even if IMHO it's unlikely that it'll be ported as soon as there is the Pegasos).
> 4. The continuation of bullshit and fud spreading by competitors(BBRV)
> strengthens my belives that they are afraid of AmigaOne and OS4 and thats its
> a better product. They have spend alot of money, and none comming in(bill
> bucks words) and they need to change that, they think spreading fud and lying
> about its competitors will change that. Terrasoft where parters with thendic,
> suddenly they sell Teron boards and Bill Buck again comes with the speach of
> his life about 'We are being crushed' and 'YDL will crash and burn'
The same can be said about Ben Hermans, he has spread a lot of FUDs and BS about MorphOS in the not so far past. Like "MorphOS Team have seen the AmigaOS sources" or "MorphOS is illegal" and so on.
Regards |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 194 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 17:43 GMT | In reply to Comment 192 (Frodon):
the morphos 'featurelist' is actually a featurelist of all software included
where OS4 have a 'ppc native movieplayer' , morphos lists all audio and
video codecs supported by Frogger.
So most of the morphos featurelist are amiga features
remove
MysticView - Modern picture viewer
Voyager - Fastest Web Broswer
APDF v3
TurboPrint v7
Frogger - Media Player
AmiTCP v5 - TCP/IP protocol stack
FFS2 FastFileSystem2
SFS SmartFilesystem
Poseidon - Complete USB protocol stack
>the MorphOS feature list is far more complete and contain far more interesting
> and usefull information to make a choice
with the amiga features removed, the list is as short as the OS4 one... |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 195 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by David Scheibler on 27-Dec-2002 17:54 GMT | In reply to Comment 194 (catohagen):
>So most of the morphos featurelist are amiga features
No, as some of the quoted software has been developed exclusively for MorphOS
or will use features which the AmigaOS version doesn't offer.
What I find a bit strange in your comments is that you are blaming Bill Buck
for spreading FUD about AOS while Hyperion and connected persons have their own
campaign against MorphOS since it was first announced in 2000 or even have done
their agenda against MorphOS developers since 1996/7. I haven't read anything
about those issues back then from you... |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 196 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 17:59 GMT | In reply to Comment 194 (catohagen):
Hello,
> the morphos 'featurelist' is actually a featurelist of all software included
> where OS4 have a 'ppc native movieplayer' , morphos lists all audio and
> video codecs supported by Frogger.
> So most of the morphos featurelist are amiga features
Oh well you want to know the name of the "PPC Native MoviePlayer" of AmigaOS 4? It's simply Action (i.e: Moovid) in its PPC version (so Moovid PPC).
So as far as I understand you prefer feature list where software included are not named, great. FYI all software included in MorphOS are licensed and so fully registered. Every OSes in the world include softwares like that, this is of course also the case for AmigaOS 4. Your argument is ridiculous
> remove
> MysticView - Modern picture viewer
> Voyager - Fastest Web Broswer
> APDF v3
> TurboPrint v7
> Frogger - Media Player
> AmiTCP v5 - TCP/IP protocol stack
> FFS2 FastFileSystem2
> SFS SmartFilesystem
> Poseidon - Complete USB protocol stack
Ok then remove all the softwares included from the AmigaOS 4.0 feature list also, you'll then have a really tiny list. Again, it's ridiculous.
> with the amiga features removed, the list is as short as the OS4 one...
Even with that the list is far more detailed. Again read the PDF or Text full version, each element are detailed contrary to the AmigaOS 4.0 feature list.
Regards |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 197 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 18:04 GMT | In reply to Comment 194 (catohagen):
Hello,
Btw i've looked at the AOS 4.0 feature list again and even the "PPC Native Movieplayer" is named, here the quote of the feature list:
* PPC native movieplayer ("Action" with DivX and MPEG4 support)
And Action is nothing else than a licensed version for AmigaOS of Moovid. Which are the case of course of all software included in MorphOS as well as of all software included in AmigaOS 4.0.
So your argument is really a non sense.
Regards |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 198 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by catohagen on 27-Dec-2002 18:06 GMT | In reply to Comment 193 (Frodon):
>The same can be said about Ben Hermans, he has spread a lot of FUDs and BS
>about MorphOS in the not so far past. Like "MorphOS Team have seen the
>AmigaOS sources" or "MorphOS is illegal" and so on.
Amiga Inc claimed they used illegally obtained AmigaOS source code to develop
their product, so if Amiga Inc have proof of this, Ben Hermans isn't spreading
lies and fud with saying this. I haven't seen proof that Morphos didnt use
illegally obtained code to provide AmigaOS compatability. |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 199 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by David Scheibler on 27-Dec-2002 18:11 GMT | In reply to Comment 198 (catohagen):
The point is: MorphOS doesn't have to proof what they are not using, Amiga
inc. has to proof that they *are* using illegal sources. It's just a dirty
campaign and it isn't called without a reason "lawyer-assisted marketing". |
|
| "Season's Greetings from Amiga HQ": Hm? : Comment 200 of 220 | ANN.lu |
| Posted by Frodon on 27-Dec-2002 18:12 GMT | In reply to Comment 198 (catohagen):
Hello,
> Amiga Inc claimed they used illegally obtained AmigaOS source code to develop
> their product, so if Amiga Inc have proof of this, Ben Hermans isn't spreading
> lies and fud with saying this. I haven't seen proof that Morphos didnt use
> illegally obtained code to provide AmigaOS compatability.
Amiga Inc have no proof of that otherwise the famous D-Day would have happened. But no legal action have been made against Thendic/BPlan/Genesi from Amiga Inc.
It's FUDs and BS, period.
Regards |
|
|
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