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[News] AROS bounty programANN.lu
Posted on 06-May-2003 13:36 GMT by Teemu I. Yliselä119 comments
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The AROS support group TeamAROS has initiated a bounty program through which people can donate money for AROS development. The program has so far received a total sum of $1050 coming from Genesi (through Phoenix), Randy Vice and Bernard Giltrap.
AROS bounty program : Comment 1 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 06-May-2003 12:43 GMT
This is a good initiative! But what if the coder can't complete the
project and doesn't get paid. What will happen to the code? Will the
programmer still donate it to AROS?
AROS bounty program : Comment 2 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Elwood on 06-May-2003 13:05 GMT
I tried to do this a longggg time ago. Maybe it will work better now...
AROS bounty program : Comment 3 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Christophe Decanini on 06-May-2003 13:09 GMT
I'm glad to see Dammy spending time and energy on something constructive.
AROS bounty program : Comment 4 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by dammy on 06-May-2003 13:36 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (Anonymous):
Code goes into the AROS Dev's CVS(s) for the devs to decide if it's stable and useful so they can work with the author to fix any major bugs. The code submitted to the AROS Dev's has to be open source, perferred license is APL.

Dammy
AROS bounty program : Comment 5 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by anonymous on 06-May-2003 13:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (Anonymous):
Hello
Is it possible to create Commercial Spin Off OS project for Multimedia, Utility Computing or other applications? (with DE, GNU, QT, Bristol, MKS and other portable libraries).
Perhaps AROS team can create a good, realistic financial plan and proposal for investors. (US$ M). Is it possible to get a good "Return of Investment" rate and profit from the commercial project?
AROS bounty program : Comment 6 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 06-May-2003 14:13 GMT
there is a thread over at moobunny...It'd be a real bummer for AROS dev to be focused towards porting an incomplete system to the PPC rathr then focusing efforts to produce a complete system.Genesi has a main focus on selling their PPC hardware and using OS's as bait to try and increase their poytential market.the little gain to be obtained for Genesi is at the larger expense of thise who would otherwise be able to sooner run a complete AROS system on there currently owned x86 hardware.I have nothing against PPC hardware, as I do understand it is a technically superior architecture to that of the X86 line.But I'm not going to go out an buy PPC hardware to try out AROS. I am more likely to try out AROS on the far more in use hardware of the x86 first. Where in time, when the software base grows and I see a need to upgrade my hardware..... well in teh mean time there will have been plenty of time to then port a complete AROS system over to technically better hardware. weigh the difference of value to be had in focusing on completing the AROS system where it is already best running on vs. the distraction of porting an incomplete system to....When the OS is not tied to a particular hardware architecture the consumers will do what consumers do, buy the best price performance hardware.but currently most people are using x86 and to move to PPC most would probably prefer to do it a step at a time, first the OS and software.....then the hardware.of course if the intent is to create some degree of exclusion, by steeping on the transistion line, blocking the way.......
AROS bounty program : Comment 7 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Xeyes on 06-May-2003 14:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (3seas):
I heard a rumor from this Teamster at a truckstop, that the Corlione family is investing heavily into PPC Aros. What could it mean??
AROS bounty program : Comment 8 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by dammy on 06-May-2003 14:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (3seas):
AROS is designed to be portable, but the main developement will be x86 unless you know something that I don't.

Dammy
AROS bounty program : Comment 9 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 06-May-2003 14:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 7 (Xeyes):
that the development directions of AROS is up for sale........to the highest financial contributor?That would make someone like me feel once again like being stabbed in the back by corporate controlled interest. Regardless of the fact I'm the comsumer for which corporate trys to sell to.
AROS bounty program : Comment 10 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 06-May-2003 14:45 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (3seas):
That's a very valid point! I agree to the fullest.
AROS bounty program : Comment 11 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by dammy on 06-May-2003 14:45 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (3seas):
If Bill Gate wants to donate a few Billion, I doubt AROS Devs will bitch much about pumping out a huge amount of APL code. :P

Dammy
AROS bounty program : Comment 12 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 06-May-2003 14:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 8 (dammy):
Don't play dumb. Bull Bick made it perfectly clear that Genesi thru Phenix has pursed the TeamAROS bounty for the purpose of PPC development.And you know that.
AROS bounty program : Comment 13 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 06-May-2003 15:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 11 (dammy):
Bill Gates doesn't contribute to competition (even of such terms as this where there isn't so much direct competition but the game of winning control over) without strings attached that he will eventually pull.The Free Software Foundation would most certainly pass on such an offer from MS.But Free Software still is compilable to run on MS based systems.....
AROS bounty program : Comment 14 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 06-May-2003 15:24 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (3seas):
Oh dear, RueBot is losing it again.

Run for cover!

(Interesting how Rue expects everyone else to work for free to provide him with what he wants, and he bitches and moans when he thinks that people might actually receive a tiny financial reward for their hard efforts.)
AROS bounty program : Comment 15 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by dammy on 06-May-2003 16:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (3seas):
> Don't play dumb. Bull Bick made it perfectly clear that Genesi thru Phenix has
> pursed the TeamAROS bounty for the purpose of PPC development. And you know
> that.

Tim, Buck has said he wants AROS to run on Pegasus and has DONATED a pegasus mobo to AROS to achieve that goal. Did you scream about that? More things that AROS runs on, the better, IMO. I'm sadden you've taken a conspiracy trek on this. I would have figured you would have been onboard with us as you have been begging Adam to update python and have offered him money to do so. Here is a perfect way for *anyone* (even Bill Gates) to donate some small amount of cash toward their favorite application developement for AROS that not only will benefit a developer or two, but the entire AROS community as well.

I get someone to generously donate a good sum of $1K for the AROS devs, and you go loco on me. Great Spirit help me if Amiga Inc donates money for the devs via TeamAROS, you will go ballastic in conspiracy issues! Breath deeply and keep repeating to yourself, "AROS Public License" a few times, perhaps that will calm you down. If not, go raise monies yourself.

Dammy
AROS bounty program : Comment 16 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by NihilVor on 06-May-2003 17:02 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (dammy):
While I feel that it would be unfortunate if Buck had some say in the future of AROS, and I wouldn’t want to see development bogged down for a Pegasus release, the AROS crew could use the money. As long as they don’t side track x86 development for Buck’s machine, it could be a very positive step. AROS has one worthy purpose and they should conquer that before they pursue other risky interests at the polemical site of Amiga politics.

Buck is free to pursue his business interests and AROS benefits without being unduly influences, so much the better.

>Great Spirit help me if Amiga Inc donates money for the devs via TeamAROS,
> you will go ballastic in conspiracy issues!

Although Amiga has said some encouraging things regarding AROS, I doubt they have the funds at this time.
AROS bounty program : Comment 17 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 06-May-2003 17:17 GMT
In reply to Comment 15 (dammy):
Why are you trying to stab me in the back? Or is that just your ignorance at work?Dammy, you assume more than you should, amd this is far from the first time recent that you have done so towards me.So why are you doing it?
AROS bounty program : Comment 18 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by greenboy on 06-May-2003 17:25 GMT
In reply to Comment 16 (NihilVor):
> NihilVor :
While I feel that it would be unfortunate if Buck had some say in the future of AROS

Actually that is why Phoenix is administering the program and performing as liaison. The simple goal is to get AROS ported to the Pegasos. Any other coding considerations will come from enthusiasm, and the idea that PPC support could be attractive to some adopters of AROS. A number of AROS people beyond those involved in the porting are also going to participate because they asked to, ie, they think it's a good way to spend some of their time.


>and I wouldn’t want to see development bogged down for a Pegasus release, the AROS crew could use the money. As long as they don’t side track x86 development for Buck’s machine, it could be a very positive step.

I don't think the AROS crew sees it as an issue. No sidetracking. They may indeed see advantages to assuring that it operates on another platform.


>AROS has one worthy purpose and they should conquer that before they pursue other risky interests at the polemical site of Amiga politics.

In all my private and list emails the AROS crew expressed absolutely no interest in others' politico-cultural clashes when they decided they would like to have at it. And why should they? We are providing a way for them via funds to further both x86 and PPC development, and allowing those who like hands-on geek-outs to get a good fix - to have some fun!


>Buck is free to pursue his business interests and AROS benefits without being unduly influences, so much the better.

This involves an interest Phoenix has wanted to pursue for some time; to be more directly involved with the AROS people. Up to now its mainly been linking each others' sites and reading each others' mail lists. Now it's more. These are good guys, and Bill and Raquel agreed with me that they were worthy of some boost. When Damocles was thinking of getting a funding apparatus together that would continue to benefit AROS it was decided that would be a nice way to get THAT rolling too...


<--greenboy---<<<<
coordinator & facilitator-at-large
Phoenix Developer Consortium [http://phinixi.com]
 
AROS bounty program : Comment 19 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 17:27 GMT
I think the AROS guys do deserve some money.

I can understand the view that I think Bill Buck has as far as the more OS's that run on his hardware the more he will be able to sell. But what about MorphOS? I mean I don't think that financially supporting 2 pretty close to identical operating systems makes much sense. Is money still going to be spent enhancing MorphOS? How does this make financial sense? Maybe they plan to merge MorphOS and AROS together in the future? That's about all I can figure.

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 20 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by greenboy on 06-May-2003 17:33 GMT
In reply to Comment 19 (AmigaGuy):
> AmigaGuy :
>Maybe they plan to merge MorphOS and AROS together in the future? That's about all I can figure

And will Genesi also be merging with all the other operating systems being ported?...

No - there is an advantage in having many OSes run on the hardware: for the advancement of PPC platforms in general, and for embedded and OEM service markets - and more specifically because Pegasos sales can subsidize MorphOS development.

There is a plan here, and it is a lot simpler because Genesi has both OS and custom hardware as their own...
AROS bounty program : Comment 21 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 06-May-2003 17:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (3seas):
> Don't play dumb. Bull Bick made it perfectly clear that Genesi thru Phenix
> has pursed the TeamAROS bounty for the purpose of PPC development.
> And you know that.

Yes, the pegasos has been donated in order to port AROS to is, and the money is also for that purpose. However, no one forced us to accept the offer, thus we've done it in our fullest ability to take such decision.

AROS is meant to be portable, the PPC will offer us a chance to PROVE it, and also get rid of some nasty bugs which afflict it. The PPC, in fact, is a very different architecture than x86, and has its special needs which we have to take care of. Right now AROS is too focused on x86, and this is the right occasion to tackle those portability issues before they get out of control.

Expect to see AROS running on the pegasos, under linux, in a few weeks.
AROS bounty program : Comment 22 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 06-May-2003 17:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Anonymous):
> (Interesting how Rue expects everyone else to work for free to provide him
> with what he wants, and he bitches and moans when he thinks that people
> might actually receive a tiny financial reward for their hard efforts.)

That's really not true. Tim is the one who contributed most money to Adam's sponsoring initative. You'd not even believe how much he donated.
AROS bounty program : Comment 23 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Kolbjørn Barmen on 06-May-2003 17:41 GMT
I'd pay a bunchload for AROS on ARM/Xscale based PDAs,
especially Zuarus since that's what I have :)
AROS bounty program : Comment 24 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmgiaGuy on 06-May-2003 17:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (greenboy):
"And will Genesi also be merging with all the other operating systems being ported?... "

No, I wouldn't think they would merge with any of the other operating systems being ported as they are quite different from MorphOS where as AROS is very very similar.

They are spending money on 2 pretty much indentical OSes. The only logical thing for a company to do at somepoint that is spending money on 2 similar prjects, would be to either 1. Choose the best 1 out of the 2 and drop the other or 2. At somepoint merge the 2 together taking the best parts from each one. I doesn't seem like it would make much sense to spend money on 2 groups doing the same thing.

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 25 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 06-May-2003 17:43 GMT
In reply to Comment 21 (Anonymous):
Sorry, that was me.
AROS bounty program : Comment 26 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 17:50 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (greenboy):
@greenboy

I guess what I'm trying to say is that if what your saying is true that they are going to use the extra sales to subsidize MorphOS development. Won't that really hurt them in the end. Who will pay for MorphOS if they can get pretty much the exact same in AROS for free??

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 27 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Kolbjørn Barmen on 06-May-2003 17:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 24 (AmgiaGuy):
Or perhaps they have a broader view on this?

In the series of Amiga-like systems we can now have several to pick from, to run on a variety of hardware - it does make a heck lot of sense for everyone to share code across these systems.

Who knows.. perhaps at some point there will be need for some "POSAMI", as POSIX is for UNIX - Portable Operating System for unIX, only for Amiga like systems.

Oh well... I can dream... :)
AROS bounty program : Comment 28 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by greenboy on 06-May-2003 17:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 24 (AmgiaGuy):
I've already explained a few reasons why we have all chosen to get involved together. part of it is also that we want to work as community, and for the entities involved this is possible. Further, many early adopters (and developers) would enjoy having multiple-boot systems with these OSes. So, helping supply that is another way to provide better value for any Pegasos and MorphOS and AROS users (and developers).


<--greenboy---<<<<
coordinator & facilitator-at-large
Phoenix Developer Consortium [http://phinixi.com]
 
AROS bounty program : Comment 29 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by greenboy on 06-May-2003 18:00 GMT
I'd also like to note that AROS and the MorphOS crew led the way for this kind of enlightened self-interest by doing some sharing already. And both code bases have benefited.
AROS bounty program : Comment 30 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 18:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 29 (greenboy):
I think it's great that you guys are helping and sharing.

I think if the PegII is a good price and can run many different OSes then that would be way cool!

If I got one when available and I could run all these different OSes I think I'd want to buy:

MacOS

Linux

etc, but the thing is when I go to choose an Amiga "like" OS then I would choose AROS over MorphOS for no other reason then it's so smiliar and FREE :)

I would just think that would hurt you guys as far as the software side of your business goes as I'd think most people would choose AROS.

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 31 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 06-May-2003 18:12 GMT
non-sequitur - an inferance or conclusion that does not follow from the premises. What brown stuff is made of.:7 brown stuff is getting deep around here.
AROS bounty program : Comment 32 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 06-May-2003 18:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 26 (AmigaGuy):
And who told you that you pay for MorphOS when you buy a Pegasos?
You always get it, it's free.
AROS bounty program : Comment 33 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 06-May-2003 18:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (AmigaGuy):
Ehm, AROS does not currently run any AmigaOS 68k apps, nor does it plan to do in
the near future. It's not the same thing. +As I said, MOS comes with the Peg,
for free.
AROS bounty program : Comment 34 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 06-May-2003 18:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 31 (3seas):
> non-sequitur - an inferance or conclusion that does not follow from the
> premises. What brown stuff is made of.
> :7 brown stuff is getting deep around here

Whom are you respoding to?
AROS bounty program : Comment 35 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 18:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 33 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
True it doesn't run 68k apps. They do have UAE for AROS though :) Who knows maybe someone will right something that enables 68k apps to run in the future.

If you have 1 Amiga "like" OS (try to be politically correct) running on MorphOS will there really be need for MorphOS? If Genisi could say we can run Mac, Linux, and Amiga isn't that all that matters? I guess they can co-exist as I suppose they are lots of flavors or Linux too.

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 36 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Megol on 06-May-2003 18:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Anonymous):
>Oh dear, RueBot is losing it again.
>Run for cover!

Oh no, Anonymous Cowardius is talking shit again!

>(Interesting how Rue expects everyone else to work for free to provide him >with what he wants, ...

Well I guess you should inform yourself before assuming tings.

> ... and he bitches and moans when he thinks that people might actually
> receive a tiny financial reward for their hard efforts.)

Where do you see this? As I only see that he fears that the development of AROS will become more targeted towards PPC instead of x86.
I don't know if it would really be a problem as most of AROS consists of portable C-code and a port to PPC would most likely "shake out" a few bugs (in my experience ports tend to do that)...
AROS bounty program : Comment 37 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Kolbjørn Barmen on 06-May-2003 18:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (Fabio Alemagna):
Himself - he just noticed he'd forgotten to flush his toilet for a while.
AROS bounty program : Comment 38 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 06-May-2003 18:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 35 (AmigaGuy):
Running on MorphOS? What are you talking about? They gonna make a Pegasos native
version.
BTW, Amiga like & Amiga API compatible != Amiga Binary compatible.
AROS bounty program : Comment 39 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Kolbjørn Barmen on 06-May-2003 18:45 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
He meant Pegasos, and not MorphOS in that sentance, obviously.
AROS bounty program : Comment 40 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 18:46 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
I meant that maybe someday some will add a 68k emulation layer. I realize it kind of defeats the purpose of AROS a little as they want to have people recompile their sources, but as some one noted that is an advantage that MorphOS has over AROS.

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 41 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 18:48 GMT
In reply to Comment 40 (AmigaGuy):
Crap.. err..what Kolbjørn Barmen said. I meant running on Peg :)
AROS bounty program : Comment 42 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 06-May-2003 18:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 38 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
> BTW, Amiga like & Amiga API compatible != Amiga Binary compatible

AROS is binary compatible for everything, except DOS handlers and stuff which deals with DOS handlers.

If we find (as it's likely) binary incompatibilities other than those ones, then that's a bug, that needs to be fixed.

On PPC a 68k emulator is much more likely be implemented. I might even decide to finish up the one I started 5 years ago (about 40% complete).
AROS bounty program : Comment 43 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 06-May-2003 18:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 40 (AmigaGuy):
Ok, sorry.
MorphOS and AROS are two different things. MorphOS has some API extensions, AROS
has others. They have some common ones. The user interface is NOT the same, nor
some other stuff.
AROS bounty program : Comment 44 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 06-May-2003 18:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 42 (Fabio Alemagna):
Well, ok, I just wrote what I had read about the 68k emul story so far.
AROS bounty program : Comment 45 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by greenboy on 06-May-2003 19:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 42 (Fabio Alemagna):
> Fabio Alemagna :
>On PPC a 68k emulator is much more likely be implemented. I might even decide to finish up the one I started 5 years ago (about 40% complete).

See folks? - there's already one of the potential benefits for getting together : }
AROS bounty program : Comment 46 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by AmigaGuy on 06-May-2003 19:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 41 (AmigaGuy):
Does it seem a little odd though have two versions of Amiga-ish OSes on one platform. I just think that if AmigaOS had been ported to X86 back in the day, then it would have made little sense to start AROS at all.

Now on the PEG we will have MorphOS and AROS. Being so similar do you think one will eventually dominate or do you think they will co-exist? From my perspective I wouldn't want to have to run AROS for one Amiga-ish App then run MorphOS to run another Amiga-ish app.

All I'm asking is am I crazy??? Or does it at least seem a little odd.

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 47 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 06-May-2003 19:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 45 (greenboy):
> See folks? - there's already one of the potential benefits for getting together
> : }

Hey, no promises! :) That was actually my fist project in C, and I had learned C only a few months before, in a course at university (played with E and AMOS before then). Then I departed for the military service, and then other things got in, including AROS. It was part of a complete amiga emulator.

Nowadays, if I had to do a 68k emulator, it's more likely I'd do it from scratch, though.
AROS bounty program : Comment 48 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by greenboy on 06-May-2003 19:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 30 (AmigaGuy):
AmigaGuy, as the man said - MorphOS comes with every Pegasos anyway : } ...Really I don't think Genesi or Laire & crew have any worries about MorphOS not making the grade either. What's there is pretty cool, and there's lots more on the way. And there is always the application base that is and will be written for MorphOS, commercial and free.

That's to take nothing away from AROS, who have thought about a lot of different ways to improve the Amiga experience themselves, over the years, both from a development or a user perspective.

I think it's a pretty full glass.
AROS bounty program : Comment 49 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by amigaguy on 06-May-2003 19:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 48 (greenboy):
@greenboy

I guess we'll see how it works out. I suppose at worst people can run their favorite Amiga apps 2 different ways on the PEG :) (This is assuming that the app gets ported to both MorphOS and AROS) Still seems kinda redundant to me though :)

AmigaGuy
AROS bounty program : Comment 50 of 119ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 06-May-2003 19:46 GMT
In reply to Comment 49 (amigaguy):
> This is assuming that the app gets ported to both MorphOS and AROS) Still seems
> kinda redundant to me though

Not saying it's going to be like this, but there might possibly be binary compatibility between AROS and MOS on PPC.
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