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[Forum] Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routineANN.lu
Posted on 29-May-2003 10:17 GMT by Ews21 comments
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In the interview of Maciej Binek, President, Elbox Computer, Elbox denies any existence of RDB trashing code. RS: Rafal Sanda, ACP Interviewer
MB: Maciej Binek, President, Elbox Computer

SR: Is it true that your drivers had code erasing the RDB?

MB: No, our drivers never included code aimed at erasing RDB.

Erasing RDB by a cracker (if it had happened at all: you see, no-one contacted us on this issue) could only result from operating code created by the cracker from modification of our software.

It is obvious that we cannot be responsible for effects of software resulting from illegal modification of our software code.

--

pci.library before version 5.9 was confirmed to contain the RDB trashing routine, by several independent sources.

Please feel free to check the claim by using elboxdecrypt on pci.library earlier than 5.9.

Anyone with basic programming skills can see that the elboxdecrypt is not adding anything to the resulting decrypted binary. Someone with more skills can tell you that the routine is not "creating" anything, it is merely performing the decryption process that is done each time the library is initialized. So the RDB trashing code is always present in memory if the pre-5.9 pci.library is loaded.

Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 1 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous (217.36.23.51) on 29-May-2003 08:26 GMT
Duh. It's an Amiga company. All Amiga companies are run by slime. How else do you survive when you're selling a sub-standard product to a very small number of customers?

Change inflated prices, hussle customers, take QA shortcuts, provide as little support as possible, take money for non-existent products, refuse to pay your staff, etc. etc.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 2 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by DaveP (194.196.110.14) on 29-May-2003 08:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 1 (Anonymous):
Article 5-6 months old.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 3 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by MiniBobF (193.130.116.241) on 29-May-2003 08:27 GMT
"Two years ago we deliberated about using the Articia S chip (the same that
is used in Pegasos and Teron/AmigaOne) as the northbridge for SharkPPC
cards. Opinions on it obtained from Motorola representatives convinced us to
give up this idea and choose a more expensive, but more compatible chip by
IBM."

Possible CPC710, incase anyone is interested. Is it anymore "more compatible" than the next though?

Neil Thomas, AKA MiniBobF
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 4 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Peter Gordon (212.104.156.42) on 29-May-2003 08:37 GMT
What a load of crap. I saw code clearly designed to erase the RDB in a pci.library on my own system. The code was there, and it was obviously designed to only be called if someone was tampering with the library (although i could think of a few, admittedly unlikely, scenarios where it could be called by accident).
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 5 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Rafo (213.41.178.149) on 29-May-2003 08:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 2 (DaveP):
Absolutely, and I guess that was published BEFORE existence of this
routine was proved, then the routine was removed.

Talking about this AGAIN look kinda slimy to me, as it's already been
discussed and overdiscussed then.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 6 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by DaveP (194.196.110.14) on 29-May-2003 08:55 GMT
Perhaps the userbase isn't happy unless it is feeling outraged and let down about something.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 7 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by DaveP (194.196.110.14) on 29-May-2003 08:55 GMT
Perhaps the userbase isn't happy unless it is feeling outraged and let down about something.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 8 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Peter Gordon (212.104.156.42) on 29-May-2003 08:59 GMT
In reply to Comment 6 (DaveP):
Or perhaps there really was some nasty code in the drivers? Hmm?
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 9 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by DaveP (194.196.110.14) on 29-May-2003 09:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 8 (Peter Gordon):
What nooooooo!

This is the first time anyone ever said such a thing or even proved it!


It took the reposting of a 6 month old interview cross referenced with a simple how to prove it guide which has its origins in even older material to tell me.

I wouldn't have known if this entire thing hadn't been repeated for the 99th time with nothing new added.

Peter, I think you may be right. Its not that the userbase likes talking about negative s**t all the time, its because it needed the 99th repeat of the same information and highlighting of Elbox denials before Id see the point.

That *must* be it.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 10 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re (212.239.165.75) on 29-May-2003 09:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (DaveP):
Don't you all just *love* sarcasm? ;)

Cheers
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 11 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Peter Gordon (212.104.156.42) on 29-May-2003 10:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 9 (DaveP):
Whatever.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 12 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous (130.233.220.23) on 29-May-2003 10:17 GMT
Why you have to post 6 months old interview here ? Is the only reason to create another flamewar or what ? :P This issue has talked about million times. :P
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 13 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Peter Gordon (212.104.156.42) on 29-May-2003 11:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 12 (Anonymous):
Yeah, even though I do harbour a certain amount of hostility toward the aforementioned company for this and some of their licensing practices (which caused me to take the bait and post), I do agree that this thread is needless and should be deleted.

In fact, I like to imagine Christian doing a Strongbad impression and shouting "Deleted!" in a silly accent as he removes it :)
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 14 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by Neko (194.222.178.131) on 29-May-2003 11:36 GMT
I love this quote:

"Two years ago we deliberated about using the Articia S chip (the same that
is used in Pegasos and Teron/AmigaOne) as the northbridge for SharkPPC
cards. Opinions on it obtained from Motorola representatives convinced us to
give up this idea and choose a more expensive, but more compatible chip by
IBM."

:)

Neko
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 15 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by DaveP (194.196.110.14) on 29-May-2003 11:46 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Neko):
Yes, it was the only bit of the article that popped out at me again too! Id love a more detailed statement from them on what this is all about.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 16 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by MarkTime (208.161.156.2) on 29-May-2003 11:57 GMT
well elbox has some technical chops, so the possibility of a shark has always intrigued me, but where is it?
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 17 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by [JC] (82.38.104.95) on 29-May-2003 12:45 GMT
This Elbox guy is a liar.

I had a 100% legal amiga using friend of mine send me his pci.library back when this issue first came to light, and I took the time to decrypt the binary myself (using a 68000 simulator) and disassembled it. There is code in there to erase the RDB. I didn't bother determining how it was triggered.

If Elbox had tried this in any other market, they would be liable for damages and also the wilful destruction of data, serious offences in the UK and many other parts of the world.

It's amazing what Amigan's will put up with.
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 18 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by takemehomegrandma (Registered user) on 29-May-2003 13:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 14 (Neko):
> I love this quote:
>
> "Two years ago we deliberated about using the Articia S chip (the same that
> is used in Pegasos and Teron/AmigaOne) as the northbridge for SharkPPC
> cards. Opinions on it obtained from Motorola representatives convinced us to
> give up this idea and choose a more expensive, but more compatible chip by
> IBM."
>
> :)
>
> Neko

"No, there are no problems with the Articia whatsoever" ... ;-)
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 19 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by MiniBobF (193.130.116.241) on 29-May-2003 13:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 18 (takemehomegrandma):
"Opinions on it obtained from Motorola representatives convinced us to
give up this idea and choose a more expensive, but more compatible chip by
IBM."

Something's a bit fishy here as Motorola wouldn't recommend a competitors' Northbridge... they recommend their own (MPC106/107).

Neil Thomas, AKA MiniBobF
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 20 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by PMC (81.5.147.94) on 29-May-2003 13:34 GMT
We went all through this here months ago.

We all have our own opinions, and nothing new can be added here.

What about the other subjects in the post - ie the development of the SharkPPC? Can't we have some reasoned discussion aout that instead?
Elbox denies existance of RDB trashing routine : Comment 21 of 21ANN.lu
Posted by coldfire (166.102.53.92) on 30-May-2003 05:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 20 (PMC):
What about the other subjects in the post - ie the development of the SharkPPC? Can't we have some reasoned discussion aout that instead?

I think not. Back to the flame wars!

coldfire
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