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[Rant] Hostage NegotiationANN.lu
Posted on 27-Jan-2004 02:07 GMT by Greg Ford260 comments
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There are a group of people, at Amiga Inc, who have decided that their personal reasons are more important than the interests of the company, employees, investors, the customers, and even potential customers, and have ceased any and all effort to involve themselves in anything at all that doesn't directly relate to these personal reasons, even if it means earning an income against it's current mountain of debts. Amiga is being held hostage, and someone's looking to do something about it. The only people that were in any position to remedy this situation were a group of investors who had already lost fortunes in Amiga Inc, and were asked for more money. They were concerned over the money already invested, but told that unless they invested more, they'd never see any returns on these investments ever. The investors didn't like this at all, they felt, exactly like I said, that the small group of people at Amiga Inc, were literally holding Amiga hostage for more money. They did the only thing they could do, they hired Garry Hare to try to restart the company and salvage something for the investors who had already invested large amounts of capital into the failed company.

The problem was, those few at Amiga quickly realised that this was an attempt to get around Amiga Inc's demands for more investment capital, and completely refused to cooporate with Garry Hare, and even going so far as to publicly obfuscate to it's customers Garry's position in the failing company. Garry was instrumental in generating dozens of potentially profitable leads in his three month project that he spent representimg Amiga Inc at tradeshows and technology conferences. Many business contacts and developers became interested and attempted to follow up on these leads, only to be shunned by Amiga Inc who was making it very clear to the investors that they will not be subverted in this way. Either they would invest more capital like Amiga Inc demanded, or Amiga Inc would literally sit on their hands at Amiga Inc and do absolutely nothing, ensuring that the investors money would not produce any potential profits at all, and keeping Amiga Inc in a nonproductive stasis untill such a time when the investors will finally cave in to their demands and give them the investment capital.

To this day Amiga Inc. and the investors are still locked in a standoff, and it appears that neither will give in to the other. The investors are still looking for a way to controll the damage, to get at least a little back from their investment or even wrestle controll as to lead Amiga into promoting it's current technology, while Amiga Inc refuse to both (1) go bankrupt, instead hoping the investors will cave in to Amiga Inc's demands, or (2) try to generate an income, they will not do this as this would be giving in to the investors, who they want more money from.

There is no right or wrong being implied here, but the fact remains nothing will change untill someone gives in. It's quite apparent Amiga Inc believes that it will be the investors who will give in, as they speak quite publically about expecting the next round of funding to be recieved any day now. However I don't know if Amiga Inc realise that, as we speak, the leads that have been generated in spite of Amiga Inc's steadfast resolve to hold out against the investors are being contacted for information about the way in which Amiga Inc has shunned them when they tried to follow up on these leads. I myself have been contacted although I couldn't offer them anything other than telling them Amiga Inc simply refused to follow up on inqueries I've sent them.

All I could gather from these people is that they are determined to do something about the situation. Unfortunately I couldn't offer them much. It would be in my own interests as well for this to be resolved one way or the other as my own plans are in stasis untill something happens as well. Someone has to give. Seeing as how I can't help them much in any way, I'd like to hear from others who might have information that might help the investors in making their case that Amiga Inc is intentionally keeping the company in stasis. I'm not sure if they are preparing legal action or whatever, but to be on the safe side, if you could refrain from posting the details, and instead contact me and I'll give you instructions on contacting the interested parties.

You can contact me at GregFordEmbedded@hotmail.com, and we can start from there. Thank you for your time.

Hostage Negotiation : Comment 101 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack on 27-Jan-2004 16:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 99 (samface):
You would blindly defend AmigaInc even if they openly admitted everything they have done.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 102 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Matt Parsons on 27-Jan-2004 16:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 101 (Jack):
He would probably just pick holes in their admission... :-)
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 103 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Matt Parsons on 27-Jan-2004 16:12 GMT
In reply to Comment 102 (Matt Parsons):
That should probably read:

He would probably just pick holes in their confession... :-)
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 104 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by kalmar on 27-Jan-2004 16:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 99 (samface):
err.

What the HELL are you talking about, Samface?
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 105 of 260ANN.lu
In reply to Comment 103 (Matt Parsons):
Message removed by Christian Kemp for violation of ANN's posting rules.
Specific reason from moderator: Profanity
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 106 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 27-Jan-2004 16:27 GMT
It's really quite amusing this thread.
Oh well, the future will show who was wrong and who was right.
Meanwhile ... more popcorn!
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 107 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Gregg on 27-Jan-2004 16:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 95 (Greg Ford):
Greg, a word of advice : your communication skills are fine - don't bother arguing with people like samface. While they may see things as black and white too, you will probably find that their dividing line between the two is perpendicular to yours - in other words, you probably aren't even sharing the same reality, and you certainly don't share the same agenda.

ghauber did make a good point about just looking for evidence on one side of the fence; it's an essential facet of _scientific_ research to also look for evidence that disproves the theory. Of course, this isn't a science lab*...

Regards,

Gregg

* : However, given the multifarious weird lifeforms here, one could be forgiven for making that assumption.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 108 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Gregg on 27-Jan-2004 16:43 GMT
In reply to Comment 35 (samface):
> In other words, we don't know jack about anything!

That's the "royal we", isn't it, samface?

I'm sorry, but I couldn't resist; he just makes it too easy...

Gregg
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 109 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Tigger on 27-Jan-2004 17:01 GMT
In reply to Comment 90 (Sam Smith):
The problem Sam is that they owe 135K in coupons on the software, on sales of 1300+ $50 coupons and the sale of 700+ $100 coupons. Most of those 2000 unit sales are people that have already paid for their Amiga One (and there OS 4) and even when OS 4 is for sale seperately, Amiga Incs share of the money is not going to be anywhere near $50, much less $100 (which Ben at one time told us was the price for OS4). So they have to hugely exceed sales of 2000 to pay back the money for the preorders, then they have all their other debt to pay for. Judgements against them are at the 400K level, so thats alot more units they need to sell before Amiga can even think about not being in the red.
-Tig
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 110 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 27-Jan-2004 17:29 GMT
In reply to Comment 76 (Lando):
>Just a further point to all of this. If AInc. are trying to avoid doing
>business with external parties then why allow OS4 to be developed?

Because OS4 has zero positive impact on their finances. Any money they were to have received from OS4 has long since been pre-payed, banked, and spent. Once OS4 hits, and those party pack vouchers and "virtual" club coupons start rolling in, it's just more debt.


And that already-payed money was just "rent money", not approaching anything a serious investor would likely contribute with.

<speculation>
Could there be more than the (until now?) apparent negligence and "not giving a crap" attitude from AInc's side to their allowing Eyetech to have a say in AmigaOS matters and the compulsory hardware licensing scheme? AmigaOS and any income from that gets killed off, Eyetech get to sell a bunch of severely marked up motherboards to us remaining devotees, AInc show their investors that they still need more cash to reach DE-heaven (the "Hostage negotiation"), and everyone's happy?
</speculation>

I can't help to think that the scenario which Greg Ford is relating looks so much like the Nigerian "419" scam. "The bazillion dollars (ONE BAZILLION U.S. DOLLARS) is in the mail, we just need a thousand more bucks, a Rolex and a laptop from you to complete the transaction. Don't stop sending money now when we're so close, and when you risk to end up looking like a fool. God bless!"
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 111 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Seehund on 27-Jan-2004 17:33 GMT
In reply to Comment 108 (Gregg):
<pluralis maiestatis>

We are not amused.

Oh wait, We are! :)

</mouahaha>
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 112 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Gregg on 27-Jan-2004 18:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 110 (Seehund):
> <speculation>
> Could there be more than the (until now?) apparent negligence and "not giving
> a crap" attitude from AInc's side to their allowing Eyetech to have a say in
> AmigaOS matters and the compulsory hardware licensing scheme? AmigaOS and any
> income from that gets killed off, Eyetech get to sell a bunch of severely
> marked up motherboards to us remaining devotees, AInc show their investors
> that they still need more cash to reach DE-heaven (the "Hostage
> negotiation"), and everyone's happy?
> </speculation>

Fun though it is (in a nasty sort of way) to suppose that, it's unlikely that AI deliberately screwed themselves with the hardware arrangement - not to say they didn't _incompetently_ screw themselves - you know, "Never blah blah blah conspiracy blah blah blah incompetence."

While Greg Ford's account does have a solid ring of truth to it, I have to believe that Bill & fleecy (B&f) did originally intend to run AI as a regualr business, albeit not quite how they presented it to "the community", and certainly without a clue as to how that might actually be done, but...

I give some credence to the alleged "I'm only in it for the buy-out" quote from Bill, but even in that scenario they would need to make AI look like a credible money-making (or at least technology-implementing) venture. Actually, it just occurred to me ('scuse me for being so late) that that "vision" may have been a major motivation for buddying up with MS - once they had a formal relationship, shurely it could only be one small step to "Hop right aboard, chaps! Here - grab this golden handshake..."?

Anyway, enough of that filthy stuff; as I have said before, the real lesson comes from considering how B&f sank to the depths they currently find themselves. Don't get smug, you spectators - there's plenty of us could end up in a similar position given a similar scenario.

Here's an analogy : a bunch of people standing in a room with a small water leak coming in one corner. Everybody thinks it's somebody's job to stop the leak, and somebody thinks that someone outside will turn the water off, shurely? Guess what : the water doesn't get turned off, and by the time someone thinks to try the door, the weight of water holds it shut.

There's only a limited amount of oxygen in the room, and if there's less of _them_, then there's more for _me_... Now things start to get pretty nasty, but perfectly justifiable from a strictly ego-centric perspective, of course...

Then the water reaches the ceiling, and all the nastiness stops - but it never really goes away...

Of course, the way to avoid all this was to open the door, go outside and turn the water off - but nobody thought that was their job at the time, and anyway it was cold and miserable outside, and I was furthest from the door, and why weren't those bastards outside helping, and...

Moral : Lazy and stupid is our natural state; if you don't make the continuing effort to overcome that, don't be surprised when consequences bite you on the backside.



Goodness me, did I really bother writing all that? What an utter waste of time and effort; where's the door?

And no, you can't have my analogy - it's mine, and I love it, warts 'n' all...

Gregg
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 113 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 18:26 GMT
to Greg Ford:

If you want to be understood as sincere, don't protest that

1. [i]I know this probably isn't what you want to hear, but this post wasn't made to spread information, but to look for it.[/i]

2. [i]My purpose here is to [b]find, and provide[/b] a certain investor with proof of the above, which he told me was happening, not to prove to [b]you[/b] that this is happening. I'm looking for proof, not spreading proof.[/i]

3. [i] It's not my theory. This is what the investors told me they know is going on.[/i]

4. [i]Hmmm... there are no facts.[/i]

when the very opening of your rant is stated [i]like a fact[/i], and more to the point, [i]as if it were [b]your direct knowledge[/b][/i]:

[i]There are a group of people, at Amiga Inc, who have decided that their personal reasons are more important than the interests of the company, employees, investors, the customers, and even potential customers, and have ceased any and all effort to involve themselves in anything at all that doesn't directly relate to these personal reasons, even if it means earning an income against it's current mountain of debts. Amiga is being held hostage, and someone's looking to do something about it.[/i]

You don't so much need a course in communication, as a course in ethics. There have been enough rumors spread about Amiga Inc's financial demise, without Yet Another Rumor Being Spread As Fact. It's absolutely incredible that you would present this as if you experienced it yourself, only then to say, well, no, it's not my experience at all -- and then you expect people to respect that?!?

To everyone else: my posting should not for one moment be read to suggest that Amiga, Inc's management does not itself likewise need a course in ethics.

The first post had it right: break open the popcorn; this whole charade is for the entertainment value of the trolls on both sides, nothing more.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 114 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 27-Jan-2004 18:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Mikey C):
Impersonation is ALWAYS bad, no matter if the victim is a respected person or
a troll.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 115 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Alkis Tsapanidis on 27-Jan-2004 18:43 GMT
In reply to Comment 60 (hooligan/dcs):
That's easy! No need to recognise anyone, EVERYONE does it:-)
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 116 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Gregg on 27-Jan-2004 18:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 113 (Jack Perry):
Oh, come on; for a start, the poor chap has had to respond to the likes of Kjetil and samface, which would drive most normal people to drooling incomprehensibility, and then he did offer apologies like :

Yea, I think I screwed the pooch with the initial post. Should have prepared a rough draft rather than doing this by the seat of my pants.

I do think his opening para. was too declamatory, and it was rather naiive to post on ANN, but that's not really his fault. It may be a good route to potential business partners of AI - who knows who lurks at ANN?

> To everyone else: my posting should not for one moment be read to suggest
> that Amiga, Inc's management does not itself likewise need a course in
> ethics.

Jolly good. Could you point us to the posts you have made to that effect, please? Save us the effort of digging around for the facts, you know.

> The first post had it right: break open the popcorn; this whole charade is
> for the entertainment value of the trolls on both sides, nothing more.

Glad you decided to join in; move along, everyone - room for one more at the back...

By the way, it's them triangular thingies in HTML, not those square wotsits they use on some Web boards like... uhh, I think I'd better stop there.

Gregg
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 117 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Sam Smith on 27-Jan-2004 18:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 109 (Tigger):
Makes sense. They do seem to have a long way to go.

---
Sam
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 118 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 19:02 GMT
In reply to Comment 116 (Gregg):
Oh, come on; for a start, the poor chap has had to respond to the likes of Kjetil and samface...

No, he didn't have to; he could have ignored them and stuck to his original attitude, rather than backpedaling and saying, "I didn't really mean it."

Jolly good. Could you point us to the posts you have made to that effect, please?

I didn't say I had made posts to that effect, either -- which, again, does not mean that I don't hold that point of view.

By the way, it's them triangular thingies in HTML, not those square wotsits they use on some Web boards like... uhh, I think I'd better stop there.

osnews.com is where I usually post things :-P
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 119 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 19:05 GMT
In reply to Comment 116 (Gregg):
And by the way, the phrasing:

Yea, I think I screwed the pooch with the initial post. Should have prepared a rough draft rather than doing this by the seat of my pants.

is not what I'd call an apology.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 120 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by MarkTime on 27-Jan-2004 19:36 GMT
In reply to Comment 119 (Jack Perry):
why would he apologize?

He hasn't done anything to apologize for, and he should recognize that he couldn't have said things any better or in any way, that wouldn't have offended some.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 121 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Gregg on 27-Jan-2004 19:37 GMT
In reply to Comment 119 (Jack Perry):
Fair enough, but he did seem contrite at least.

In essence, I differ from you in that I don't think it was Mr. Ford's primary intention to stir up trouble, but he should have put more thought into his post, and his subsequebt responses indicate that he realises that.

Shall we agree to disagree now? In the grand scheme of things, it really doesn't matter what we think anyway, does it?

Gregg
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 122 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 27-Jan-2004 20:06 GMT
In reply to Comment 115 (Alkis Tsapanidis):
>That's easy! No need to recognise anyone, EVERYONE does it:-)

God damn it Alkis. I'm a married man.. got a wife who does it for me while I zip beer and watch the game =)
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 123 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 20:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 121 (Gregg):
In essence, I differ from you in that I don't think it was Mr. Ford's primary intention to stir up trouble...

I don't think so either -- but that doesn't mean he shouldn't be more careful, and then back off protesting innocence. The original post comes awfully close to slander -- perhaps not the legal definition, but I for example wouldn't want people going around saying strongly accusatory things about me like that, then when being questioned on it backtracking and saying, there are no facts. That's just plain wrong.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 124 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Gregg on 27-Jan-2004 20:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 123 (Jack Perry):
> In essence, I differ from you in that I don't think it was Mr. Ford's
> primary intention to stir up trouble...


> I don't think so either

<snip>

Err... Maybe it's just me, but that contradicts your earlier statement :

> The first post had it right: break open the popcorn; this whole charade is
> for the entertainment value of the trolls on both sides, nothing more.

Tricky, this communication thing, isn't it?

Gregg
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 125 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Darth_X on 27-Jan-2004 20:39 GMT
In reply to Comment 101 (Jack):
You would blindly defend AmigaInc even if they openly admitted everything they have done.

Samface, is this true?
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 126 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 20:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 120 (MarkTime):
He hasn't done anything to apologize for...

I really can't disagree more. It's one thing to say Entity C has told me that entity A has done F, and my experience seems to conform to this, and both I and Entity C would like to know if anyone has information along these lines. It's another thing entirely to say, Entity A has done F; I have personal experience with this, and I have been asked by entity C to find other entities D, etc. who can give supporting evidence.

The only conclusion from Greg's subsequent waffling on the matter, is that Greg himself admits the charge could be false.

The first form admits the possibility of falsehood. The second statement presents itself as unquestionably true, and that is the form that Greg Ford used. Whether he wanted to present as demonstrable fact, something that is not, is immaterial: he did, in fact, present it as demonstrable fact, then suddenly backed away from such a strong charge.

Now, I didn't say he should apologize (although I do think he should); all I did was point out that the statement Gregg quoted was not in fact an apology. What disappoints me more is the whole tabloid-journalism atmosphere of his post, followed by such disingenuous suggestions that, "I didn't mean it -- but if I did mean it, contact me pivately to let me know."
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 127 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 20:53 GMT
In reply to Comment 124 (Gregg):
Err... Maybe it's just me, but that contradicts your earlier statement

Err... no.

His primary intention was to find out facts; I'll grant him that because I'm a nice guy.

However, the subsequent backtracking leads one to question why on earth he would make such clearly strong statements, if all he wanted were facts. Literally, he comes across as a private investigator wannabe, and a rather clumsy one at that. The post is written in such an agitprop fashion that any subsequent discussion would be nothing more than entertainment for trolls. I stand by that.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 128 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re on 27-Jan-2004 21:00 GMT
Good luck with your quest, and don't mind the people who seem unable to "get your point", your post was clear, well written and to the point.

I'm not able however to help you, as i've never had any dealings with the (current) Amiga Inc.

Hopefully, this whole mess will get settled soon, with or without Amiga Inc remaining.

Cheers
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 129 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re on 27-Jan-2004 21:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 127 (Jack Perry):
I think your exagerating there, his posts are well written, and to the point, but i won't start argueing about it neighter, as it's all moot anyway.

But lets face it, *any* post on ann.lu is food for trolls ;)

Cheers
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 130 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by 3seas on 27-Jan-2004 21:04 GMT
I see this thread and scan over it....

shaking my head I seem to gravitate towards how all this BS might be used as an some warped excuse to claim some sort of ownership over AROS by the investors in Amiga Inc. saying AROS only exist as a result of incompetance of Amiga Inc.

The SCO game.....

Oh how the consumer and consumer choice has absolutely nothing to do with running a business anymore.

The request for information...... T-Shirts, coupons, SDK licensing, etc....

All totally irrelavant....

Lets face it... the T-shirt investors are shit out of luck by now....
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 131 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by acg on 27-Jan-2004 22:05 GMT
Here we go again...by the way, what is the status of the lawsuit by Thendic..
vs. AI....I thought January 17, 2004 was the last day for representation, and then the judge would make the running??? Was that false rumor???....
Haven't seen anything on this site...or am I blind??

Sounds like Amiga bashing to me...I mean, since the company has put out very little, why would someone want to rant against it...kinda like kicking a dead
horse, no?

If they start making money with AmigaOS4, they'll have to pay off their debts..simple as that...if they are successful, someone will come in and buy them out..maybe, maybe not...
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 132 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Bodie on 27-Jan-2004 22:23 GMT
In reply to Comment 83 (pixie):
Ok to the tosser who is using my bro's nick. Get a life.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 133 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Bodie on 27-Jan-2004 22:24 GMT
In reply to Comment 132 (Bodie):
err, that wasn't directed to you pixie..
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 134 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Martin on 27-Jan-2004 23:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 132 (Bodie):
You should get a life instead of abusing ANN.

PS. get back to Amiga Inc cheerleading HQ
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 135 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 27-Jan-2004 23:08 GMT
In reply to Comment 131 (acg):
I thought January 17, 2004 was the last day for representation, and then the judge would make the running??? Was that false rumor???....

I was wondering that, too, which is the only reason I visited ann.lu today in the first place: to see what was going on there. Makes me think that no news must mean some sort of good news for Amiga, Inc; if it weren't, there would be crowds of people crowing about it.

Or maybe everyone's just forgotten :-)
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 136 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Bodie_CI5 on 27-Jan-2004 23:48 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Mikey C):
What the?!

LOL, I am important enough to be impersonated?! Me?! A spammer?! LOL!

What did I "write"?
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 137 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Bodie on 27-Jan-2004 23:53 GMT
In reply to Comment 134 (Martin):
Abusing ann.lu?

How have I abused it?
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 138 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Bodie_CI5 on 27-Jan-2004 23:53 GMT
In reply to Comment 134 (Martin):
What's up your ass?!
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 139 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Bodie_CI5 on 27-Jan-2004 23:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 51 (pixie):
Thanks for quoting that pixie... I didn't know what I "wrote" :D
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 140 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by MarkTime on 28-Jan-2004 00:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 126 (Jack Perry):
>>I couldn't disagree more.

OK, now I have to take issue too, I think its obvious that it would be possible for you to disagree more. I mean, if you took me to court, wouldn't that be a greater disagreement? What if you slapped me right in my face, wouldn't that be a greater disagreement?

ok, I'm just joshing around. I agree that sometimes idle speculation can be hurtful and wrong, and even be targetted at innocent people. But that has happened today, its just a usual rant, and against our favorite passive aggressive villains: amiga, inc.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 141 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 28-Jan-2004 04:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 140 (MarkTime):
OK, now I have to take issue too, I think its obvious that it would be possible for you to disagree more. I mean, if you took me to court, wouldn't that be a greater disagreement? What if you slapped me right in my face, wouldn't that be a greater disagreement?

LOL!! :-) point well taken
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 142 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Jan-2004 07:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 130 (3seas):
> Shaking my head I seem to gravitate towards how all this BS might be used as an
> some warped excuse to claim some sort of ownership over AROS by the investors in > Amiga Inc. saying AROS only exist as a result of incompetance of Amiga Inc.


??? Come on, Tim, now you're exagerating just a "tiny" bit :-)
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 143 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 28-Jan-2004 08:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 104 (kalmar):
Read the post I replied to.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 144 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 28-Jan-2004 08:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 125 (Darth_X):
I don't know where that logic comes from, because the only thing I've stated in here is objectivity in it's purest form. Assuming something, regardless what it might be, without something factual to back it up, is NOT beeing objective. It's prejudgemental ignorance, and I hate prejudgemental ignorance in all of it's forms. I don't care how things may *seem*, all I care about is what we know as a matter of fact.

It bothers some people that I don't jump into conclusions like they do, they assume that I have some form of agenda by doing so because anything else doesn't fit into their prejudgemental minds. Is publishing all court documents in the Amiga vs Thendic-France case "defending" Amiga Inc.? No, that has been far from flattering on Amiga Inc.'s behalf, yet I got those documents and published them for the sake of objectivity. I was fed up with Rich Woods anti-Amiga Inc. campaign with pictures of Bill McEwan's driveway and all that stalker crap. We needed a neutral source of information, published completely as-is.

The only thing I'm defending here is objective reasoning, not Amiga Inc. Speculations and assumptions will never get you any closer to the truth, and the truth is what we all want to know, right?

The only blind followers in here is people that think of Amiga as some form of philosophy of life or a religion, and that the trademark is some form of blasphemy towards this "religion".
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 145 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Jan-2004 10:02 GMT
In reply to Comment 144 (samface):
:'D

'BEST SAMFACE SPOOF EVAR!!!1111oneoneone'

well done. was that you, samuraijack?
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 146 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 28-Jan-2004 10:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 145 (Anonymous):
Drop me a mail and see if I'm spoofing.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 147 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by anon on 28-Jan-2004 10:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 145 (Anonymous):
I didn't think it was so good. no "prooved" or "beeing" :D
Actually I think it was Sammy.
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 148 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by enough is enough on 28-Jan-2004 10:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 144 (samface):
Will you people stop it with the impersonations already?!
There's no need to make samface appear a bigger retard than he is. At least make it credible...
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 149 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 28-Jan-2004 10:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 148 (enough is enough):
See comment #146.

Even better, I own the MINDRELEASE.net domain (do a dns lookup if you don't believe me), would a confirmation from webmaster AT mindrelease DOT net (spam protected writing) convince you?
Hostage Negotiation : Comment 150 of 260ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 28-Jan-2004 10:25 GMT
In reply to Comment 147 (anon):
BTW, I did make one "beeing". Sorry. :-P
Anonymous, there are 260 items in your selection (but only 160 shown due to limitation) [1 - 50] [51 - 100] [101 - 150] [151 - 200] [201 - 250] [251 - 260]
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