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[Rant] Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site.ANN.lu
Posted on 03-Feb-2004 15:32 GMT by Jordan Taylor238 comments
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Today a so-called Amiga site which was supposed to allow freedom of speech has now become a exposed heavily censored website, webmasters acting like children insulting members of the site just because they stand up and say what they think.

I feel betrayed.

Check it out yourself here

Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 151 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by EyeAm on 04-Feb-2004 14:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 146 (Wayne Hunt):
I guess you missed the point.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 152 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Christian Kemp on 04-Feb-2004 14:54 GMT
In reply to Comment 149 (Wayne Hunt):
And that is a good thing, I say.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 153 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by ikir on 04-Feb-2004 15:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 149 (Wayne Hunt):
?? But you was, right? Probably i miss something.

Anyway good for you :-)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 154 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Jack Perry on 04-Feb-2004 15:50 GMT
In reply to Comment 149 (Wayne Hunt):
I am in no way affiliated with Bill Buck, or Genesi.

Weren't you at one point in some sort of business for him? I have this vague memory that you set up the website for the American distribution of Pegasos; in fact, I thought you were the distributor.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 155 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Kolbjørn Barmen on 04-Feb-2004 16:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 152 (Christian Kemp):
Interesting reply... what's up then, you know how to do webdesign and Wayne doesnt? :)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 156 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 04-Feb-2004 16:15 GMT
In reply to Comment 149 (Wayne Hunt):
"I am in no way affiliated with Bill Buck, or Genesi."

Not long ago, if I understood corectly, both Wayne and Christian were employed by Genesi.

Can we take it that this is no longer the case?

Is there anybody here who _is_ employed, and being paid a regular salary, by Genesi?

(I don't mean unpaid "employment" as at Amiga Inc.)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 157 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 04-Feb-2004 17:17 GMT
Paying regular salary to web-people.. uhm.. not in my company (if I had one).
Unless of course my company makes websites for living, but that is another issue.

Same goes for programming aswell, at this point MOS is matured enough and only needs the last bits of polishing. If the MOS team is STILL paid regular salary, in 2004, I am amazed how Genesi does business.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 158 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by bobpuegot on 04-Feb-2004 18:58 GMT
In reply to Comment 150 (Stefan Dennis):
What part of "in no way" needs explaining? :)

If there was a relationship before, it is no more. Kind of like here too.
I'll bitch about moderation, but I'm not about to ask Webmasters about their personal lives and jobs. That's none of our business.

Genesi and Amiga Inc's rumors are fair game, as we are "customers", where we arn't "customers" of these websites.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 159 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 04-Feb-2004 19:56 GMT
In reply to Comment 157 (hooligan/dcs):
"Same goes for programming aswell, at this point MOS is matured enough and only needs the last bits of polishing. If the MOS team is STILL paid regular salary, in 2004, I am amazed how Genesi does business."

I would say that MorphOS has a great deal of coding still to do, and that Ralph will be busy full time on this and other software tasks for a long while yet, if Genesi is a viable business.

What Genesi has to sell is the design and coding skills of Carda, Schmidt and the others. They are the heart of the company. If they are not being paid, then the company is in the same state as Amiga Inc.

However, I was thinking of the various other people who appear to be more or less employed by Genesi.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 160 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 04-Feb-2004 21:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 159 (Don Cox):
It doesn't make sense to pay regular salary to ten people, if one of them is busy full time, doesn't it?
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 161 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 04-Feb-2004 21:11 GMT
In reply to Comment 159 (Don Cox):
Have to add: I don't mean lay off the rest nine. Just adjust expenses to amount of work.. sort of bounty-basis salary.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 162 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by the man in the shadows on 05-Feb-2004 02:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 126 (Jordan Taylor):
> People please post if you really have been a victim of Amiga.org moderators
> and webmasters and stop making comments about racism, religious attacks and
> other lies - which i have never witnessed on that site.

> I just want the truth to be told and expose that site for what it is, but some
> of you people have turned a honest opinion thread in to a battlefield.

I would like to announce that I have been held victim of the Amiga.org moderations. Just the other day there was a thread complaining about a duplicate doommaster account and how it was nothing but trolling. I normally don't do anything of this sort but I locked the thread posting information on how it was indeed trolling and a verified duplicate account of doommaster (per IP). There were other threads started by the same account that required locking since it was duplicated efforts. Another account I had to lock a thread on was from an account named "smerf". I didn't change the content, I left it all there for people to read in its full splendor--I locked the thread all the same. Not trying to point anyone out but it's behavior like this that I believe AO should have a section called "the darwin awards".

For those of you who don't know, there is a web site called "the darwin awards" which immortalizes an individual in their stupidity of natural selection. I've started working on such a module for Xoops where members of the community have the option of voting on a darwin award candidate. It will take a bit of time to finalize, but I hope this will help cut out the users who are blinded by what they want to see.

This whole thread is nothing much more than a farce demanding attention to an area that requires none. All the same, thank you very much for the advertising. Let the truth be told in any way that it needs to be, just remember that the sh** will always float to the top.
--
Kent Seaton
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 163 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by anonymous on 05-Feb-2004 03:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 150 (Stefan Dennis):
No no. What Wayne means is similar to what Nate Downes means when he says Genesi isn't a direct competitor to AInc.

They are, of course, but in Spaghetti-Land (land of magical sauce and enchanted kettles) they aren't.

In Spaghetti-Land.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 164 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by CaptainSparrow on 05-Feb-2004 03:22 GMT
Amiga.org are liars and 2 faced, i was on the forum for 3 years and then one day i made a joke about some new hardware that was never released and i was banned, and have been banned for about a year now, Wayne is the most hateful person i have ever met, Wayne is kinda like this .. if you say somthing i like its ok, but if you say 1 thing i disagree with then your banned and it does not matter how many times i have agree'd with you in the past. i hate that aspect in people i have they they cannot take anyone elses thoughts into aspect and understand that not everyone is going to agree with this 4th reich they call amiga.org.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 165 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by CaptainSparrow on 05-Feb-2004 03:31 GMT
but amiga no longer matters to me because they are a d'funk'd company.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 166 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 05-Feb-2004 05:59 GMT
In reply to Comment 165 (CaptainSparrow):
How DARE you call them a "company"? :)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 167 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Darth_X on 05-Feb-2004 06:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 119 (Anonymous):
So you choose to be an anonymous troll instead?
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 168 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Darth_X on 05-Feb-2004 07:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 67 (Billsey):
A apology from each member of moderation staff will be a good start and a dedicated forum for my christian information and music sheets.

The www.amigaworld.net staff are going to give you this? :)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 169 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Lennart Fridén on 05-Feb-2004 07:45 GMT
Why does people take freedom of speech in web forums for granted? If you have it, fine, stay. If you don't, move along.

That said, I haven't read the thread and I have no interest in amiga.org etc. Still, I find it *interesting* to gripe about something that isn't a right.

Be grateful for what you get for free if you use it or simply don't use it.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 170 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by MarkTime on 05-Feb-2004 13:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 164 (CaptainSparrow):
@Captain Sparrow

I don't really like moderation myself. However, with that said, its hard to take your statements at face value.

I admit I troll, I do it almost every day. Maybe not with the same vigor as some, but then again, Ihave likened people to 'big selfish whiny babies' and the like, which is quite offensive choice of words.

And yet, I've never been banned. I don't see a situation where someone is banned for joking about a product release....it just doesn't ring true. About half of the conversation around here is about joking about nonreleased products...do you see my point?
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 171 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Bill Hoggett on 05-Feb-2004 14:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 163 (anonymous):
The same Spaghetti-Land where Amiga Inc are still a trading company with real-life employees?

In that place, anything is possible. Heck, over there the Amiga might even make a comeback, and people might even consider AmigaOS4 and MorphOS to be serious operating systems.

Just don't expect the real world to reflect Spaghetti-Land, because it won't.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 172 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by anonymous on 05-Feb-2004 16:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 171 (Bill Hoggett):
Here here! I agree whole-heartedly Bill.

Also, in Spaghetti-Land you can believe that BB hiring you publicly is actually more than a simply, blatant political move, and nothing more.

In Spaghetti-Land.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 173 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by The_Editor on 05-Feb-2004 17:06 GMT
In reply to Comment 172 (anonymous):
Hey, You no fucka wiv da family !!
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 174 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Darrin on 05-Feb-2004 18:07 GMT
"Suggestions and feedback forum being closed"

No wonder because that forum should be called "Praise our moderators and site or else", and is not to allow people to make negative remarks about the bad attitude moderators or anything negative. i find that sort of censorship to stink and makes Wayne Hunt look like a total hypocrite (see his Amigaworld bashing).

Hypocrite = A person who professes beliefs and opinions that they do not hold.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 175 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Andrew Smithster on 05-Feb-2004 18:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 174 (Darrin):
Just reading that thread makes me laugh so much. Hunt is acting like a stinking two-faced coward and the usual Hunt fan club members worshipping him and refering to people who will not fall in to line as -Wankers-.

Opinions should be allowed good or bad instead of calling people names who speak their minds.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 176 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by redrumloa on 05-Feb-2004 19:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 54 (Billsey):
>I was a regular on Amiga.org but was attacked by moderators because i was in
>their terms a "Religious scumbag" who should stop being christian or get
>banned. i asked why i am being treated badly but the only reply i got
>said "if you do not like the site just f--k off bible boy).

This is not Billsey. This is a FAKE. Billsey may have had issues, but he would not lie like this
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 177 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 05-Feb-2004 19:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 176 (redrumloa):
I agree. The worst we hear from Billsey is paranoid delusions, not lies. Now if he said that Wayne was following him home from the supermarket, then it'd sound realistic.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 178 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 05-Feb-2004 21:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 175 (Andrew Smithster):
>Just reading that thread makes me laugh so much. Hunt is acting like a stinking two-faced coward and the usual Hunt fan club members worshipping him and refering to people who will not fall in to line as -Wankers-.

Oh no! Not more camps!
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 179 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 05-Feb-2004 21:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 162 (the man in the shadows):
another fake. Some loser has too much time on his hands!
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 180 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Alf Stuart on 05-Feb-2004 21:54 GMT
Amiga.org has turned in to Amigaworld2.net, first the guy sells his sole to the devil (Buck) and now he will not allow members of his site to speak freely. if someone tries to speak their mind they get insulted by the webmaster and the webmasters pets.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 181 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Raffaele on 06-Feb-2004 02:19 GMT
To avoid that the concept of writing on a forum could be considered a "priviledge" amongst some moron webmasters and moderators I post again things I wrote in msg. 117 in order that the correct concept of "opportunity" that the forums bring to us will be known, accepted and spreaded around.

>Mr. Wayne Hunt silly wrote:
>
>>We -- the Webmasters, and sponsors -- make these sites available
>>as a service to it's users.
>>It is a PRIVILEDGE to use them.
>>It is not your " inaliable right".
>>If you don't like a site, don't stick around
>>ruining it for others.

>Priviledge?
>
>Uhu?
>
>You are a very funny people indeed...
>
>
>You are the webmaster of a Forum site...
>
>To Write on it it is a CHOICE by the user
>

>>We -- the Webmasters, and sponsors -- make these sites available
>>as a service to it's users.
>>It is a PRIVILEDGE to use them.

You just created an opportunity to write in, and invited the users to write in it...

>It is WE USERS that keep your forum site alive

(by adding news, making comments, pointing to site links)

>Owners of a forum site must be grateful that WE USERS write on it...
>
>...else, without traffic, no one will pay for advertising on its pages!

Certainly we users must follows rules you made on the forum site (its your site) and keep using a certain degree of decency in netiquette

But...

If you don't like the situation that: It is us, the users who made the choice to write or not to write into your forum site, then...

>...you can just start a BLOG site...

...or a news site... and update it and maintain it you alone!!!

(and remember to say farewell to the majority of the sponsors)


With respect,

Raffaele
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 182 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Wayne Hunt on 06-Feb-2004 04:04 GMT
In reply to Comment 181 (Raffaele):
Raffaele,

Just as when you posted this initially, I fail to see any real point to your post. OF COURSE the existence of a site and forums is a two way street. Visitors depend on the site/Webmaster to provide the service. The Webmaster depends on the visitors to use it. No one is interested in running off ALL of the site's visitors or forum posters. What I am trying to get a very few "children" to understand is that forums are not their personal playground, and that "freedom of speech" does NOT equal "freedom to say whatever the hell you please, without consequence or responsibility".

If you have a problem with the fact that EVERY forum on the Web is moderated in some fashion or another, sell your computer. :-)

We're not saying that we have any interest whatsoever in interfering with someone's ability to freely express an opinion, but forums have topics -- even Amiga.org's DMZ has topics. What is the use of even having topics if the staff of the site has no authority to try to keep discussions focused on the topic at hand?

After all, why would anyone use a set of forums when searching for (as an example) "Problems with my CSPPC accelerator" leads visitors to a thread which veers off onto the tangent where people aren't talking about CSPPC accelerators at all?

Moderation is not something that our staff really wants to do. If absolutely everyone (without exception) in the community expressed themselves eloquently, used the forums responsibly, and stopped acting like spoiled twits, moderation would never be necessary. Unfortunately -- as with almost everything -- it's always that "1%" of childish morons (such as the spoofers and anonymous bashers in this thread) which make any moderation a necessary evil.

Keep in mind however that ALL Web sites are indeed private property, regardless of who owns them. Someone pays for it, someone owns it. There are no inaliable rights given to act like a twit (and no, I'm not calling you or anyone specific a twit) on private property.

Think of it this way. You may be an incredibly nice guy who loves having friends over to your house for dinner. Suppose I came over to watch "Survivor", then got pissed off because you ran out of beer and insulted your wife. I may have every right to say what I did, but in your house, you have every right to beat my ass and throw me out in the street. How are online forums (any online forums) any different?

If you're in someone's "house", even if you're there to bitch at them, you show respect. If you do not, you are not welcomed in their house. It's just that simple. It's not a mystery, and it's certainly not "rocket surgery".

Wayne
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 183 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 06-Feb-2004 07:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 182 (Wayne Hunt):
Comment #169 is really all that needs to be said about people's "right" to post anything they want on other people's websites. There is no such thing as any law or right that would prevent a webmaster from putting any restrictions he/she likes on the content of his website, period. If the visitor doesn't like it, then he/she shouldn't visit the site to begin with. End of story.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 184 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Raffaele on 06-Feb-2004 07:51 GMT
In reply to Comment 182 (Wayne Hunt):
Mr. Wayne hunt wrote:

>If you have a problem with the fact that EVERY
>forum on the Web is moderated in some fashion
>or another, sell your computer. :-)

I have no problem in the fact that Web are moderated as I said

>>Certainly we users must follows rules you made on the forum site
>>(it's your site)
>>and keep using a certain degree of decency in netiquette

But I want to warn you as a friend...

The continue use of statements like:

>If you have a problem [...] sell your computer. :-)

(now regarding me, but you made it with ANY person who criticize you)

even with a smiley at the end, seems to suggest extreme acting as usually childs do...

And it is the concept of «priviledge» which seems to me unethical and inadequate for a webmaster, who deserves all its fame and its fortunes by the acceptance of his site by the public.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 185 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Donald Fisher on 06-Feb-2004 08:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 183 (samface):
The problem is Wayne insults websites and its moderators for the exact samething he and his ott moderators do. that is the problem and it is a shame that websites (especially Amiga ones) can be run by such people.

I personally find it very sad that most Amiga sites are deteriorating over time due to stupidity by webmasters. but your right though it is better to stay away from vermin infested sites.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 186 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 06-Feb-2004 09:12 GMT
In reply to Comment 184 (Raffaele):
>And it is the concept of «priviledge» which seems to me unethical and
>inadequate for a webmaster, who deserves all its fame and its fortunes by the
>acceptance of his site by the public.

Wayne's metaphor with a website as a house was appropriate. If someone invites you to his/her house, be grateful and respect the house rules. It's as simple as that, really. And no, I fail to see why would it be unethical nor inadequate of the host to apply certain restrictions to what you may or may not do in his/her house.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 187 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by samface on 06-Feb-2004 09:30 GMT
In reply to Comment 185 (Donald Fisher):
>The problem is Wayne insults websites and its moderators for the exact
>samething he and his ott moderators do.

Well, that is an accusation aimed directly at Wayne in person and I don't intend to get involved in this issue by defending the actions of any specific individual. I was merely pointing out the flaw in claiming that posting anything you like on someone else's website would be a "right".
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 188 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Raffaele on 06-Feb-2004 10:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 186 (samface):
Mr Samface wrote:

>Wayne's metaphor with a website as a house was appropriate.
>If someone invites you to his/her house,
>be grateful and respect the house rules.
>It's as simple as that, really.
>And no, I fail to see why would it be unethical
>nor inadequate of the host to apply certain
>restrictions to what you may or may not do in his/her house.

Your example does not match correctly the situation.

A private website IS a house (home for the owner)
and in that are allowed only guests...

A Forum site is a public place as a restaurant, tearoom, etc...
and in that you must serve the clients who enter.

Yes you can say that in a five-star restaurant only gentlepersons are allowed...

But we are talking of Amiga related forums, the coffeshops of the net world.

So only a little netiquette is necessary...

...But certainly I agree that "this little" MUST be respected)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 189 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Wayne Hunt on 06-Feb-2004 14:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 188 (Raffaele):
> A Forum site is a public place as a restaurant, tearoom, etc...
> and in that you must serve the clients who enter.

I politely disagree with your analogy.

A "forum site" is still a Web site, hence still part of a "house", hence more like hanging out in my kitchen drinking margaritas that I paid for. If you want to bring your own alcohol to the party (as in make a contribution to the site) that's different. No one HAS to serve anyone. The house owner does not OWE anyone anything. You are there because he opened the door and allowed you to come into his house.

That being said, I do appreciate the fact that you at least acknowledge that a little respect is required. I don't think you and I are very far apart on this issue. The only thing you don't seem to understand is that I both respect and appreciate a vast majority of the site's users. I simply have zero tolerance for the small, vocal minority of people who are determined to make the experience of visiting a site miserable for anyone.

But I digress. There was no reason for this thread to have even been started, except that someone is unhappy with the fact that they were banned from the site permanently. Spending time supporting and discussing "Jordan Taylor"'s (whoever that is) allegations simply provides more visitors and advertising to Amiga.org at this point.

Wayne
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 190 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Tony on 06-Feb-2004 14:55 GMT
In reply to Comment 189 (Wayne Hunt):
You and your moderators will not allow freedom of speech, which in the past you have insulted other Amiga websites for the exact samething you are now doing.

We the user expects to be allowed to express our concerns against people what have clearly time and time again abused their position, which has been totally swept under the carpet (just like another Amiga site).
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 191 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Wayne Hunt on 06-Feb-2004 15:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 190 (Tony):
> You and your moderators will not allow freedom of speech

Absolutely patently not true. We absolutely cherish intelligible opinions and open discussion between visitors to the site. What we will not allow is for one visitor to come into the forums verbally abusing on other visitors and creating dozens of off-topic rant posts. Nothing more, nothing less.

Any attempts by you, or anyone too cowardly to put in their real name, to state otherwise, is simply your own childish attempt to smear Amiga.org and our staff for your own simplistic reasons or hidden agendas.

Wayne Hunt
Amiga.org
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 192 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Paul Gadd on 06-Feb-2004 15:58 GMT
What a load of bollox. if this was really going on then why not post some hard proof? (you twats can not because it is total lies).

Also my account has been suspended there due to complaints of posting links to warez (which i did and i can hold my head up high and admit it, nothing whatsoever to do with the colour of my skin,religion or any other crap you people are saying).
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 193 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 06-Feb-2004 16:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 192 (Paul Gadd):
@Gadd
Well if a, A.Org moderator admits he is more than willing and cabable to decide whats best for the reader, Hunt is simply bullshitting.
Remember, and quoting Hunt, "We absolutely cherish intelligible opinions and open discussion between visitors to the site"

Keyword, "OPEN"
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 194 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Wayne Hunt on 06-Feb-2004 16:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 193 (hooligan/dcs):
@hooligan,

Paul's contributions to Amiga.org's forums are usually intelligible and appreciated. As such, his account was suspended, not banned. Posting links to pirated material however is (and has been for a LONG time) against the posting guidelines of Amiga.org (and I'm sure this site as well).

In short, unless I'm completely misunderstanding what you're trying to say, you have no point. "Open" discussion is not the same as allowing people to post things which are against the site's well-documented and published policies.

Wayne
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 195 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Wayne Hunt on 06-Feb-2004 16:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 192 (Paul Gadd):
Paul,

Thanks. Just a reminder though that your account has not been suspended for quite a while. While everyone knows full well that piracy exists, and we all accept that most software these days on the Amiga *is* pirated, we simply cannot allow people to use Amiga.org to promote piracy.

Piracy is one of the reasons that the Amiga is "dead" today, and one of the reasons potential returning developers are reluctant to support the Amiga market again. Most old-school Amiga developers (for example, EA) still remember getting burned by working hard on a product only to see it fail to generate sales due to piracy.

I hope you understand that the suspension certainly wasn't anything personal.

Wayne
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 196 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by MikeyMike Quotes on 06-Feb-2004 16:48 GMT
In reply to Comment 193 (hooligan/dcs):
"I think I can decide what is helpful for someone or not"

"I didn't lock it, but I would have done."

"don't think I am doing a decent job as a moderator"

"if they feel I'm in the wrong, I'll leave"

"Will you boneheads ever read what I write?"

Taken from censorship central threat "Forum Moderation Techniques"
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 197 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by KonkeyDong on 06-Feb-2004 17:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 196 (MikeyMike Quotes):
Isn't Mikeymike the mod who publicly humiliated Meers and ran him off? I felt sorry for him, he was the sites most active poster and contributer to forum threads. The forums have really gone pear shaped since he and a few others have left.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 198 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 06-Feb-2004 18:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 194 (Wayne Hunt):
Pauls comments has been excellent, many times with a hefty touch of sarcasm which some people do not swallow or understand correctly. If I had to offer a free beer for someone, this is the man I'd offer it :)
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 199 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by Bill Hoggett on 06-Feb-2004 18:45 GMT
In reply to Comment 197 (KonkeyDong):
One person does not a good forum make, but then neither do the administrators.

IMHO Amiga.org has been declining a fair bit since the moderation policy _appears_ to have changed. AFAIAC it's sliding alarmingly towards the kind of attitude that I so despise about that other site. Perhaps it's just a side-effect of staff changes, perhaps a few egos feel the need to manifest themselves and remind the great unwashed just who the boss is. I don't know, but I do know that I find the site becoming more and more dull, and there's hardly been anything worth reading in my last few increasingly rare visits, never mind anything worth contributing to.

For a while there, I though Amiga.org was really going to get its act together, but now I suspect I was wrong. A shame really.
Freedom of speech is no more on a popular Amiga site. : Comment 200 of 238ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 06-Feb-2004 18:59 GMT
In reply to Comment 196 (MikeyMike Quotes):
Well, since you listed half of your comments in the thread while I was referring to only one.. all I can do is the same and quote myself in the same thread. Actually, I can't find a reason why you listed so many quotes when you perfectly know I was talking about one. Here we go anyway:

MikeyMike:
I just read that thread. After the first couple/few pages, there was so little useful/accurate content that it is very unlikely that the original poster would have found it of any use. I didn't lock it, but I would have done.

Hooligan:
Why you think you can decide what is helpful for someone and what is not? If this is really your honest opinion, better quit being a moderator as you really ain't got what it takes.

<----------------------------->

MikeyMike:
If you really don't think I am doing a decent job as a moderator, voice your concerns privately to another member of AO staff. The other AO staff will discuss it, and if they feel I'm in the wrong, I'll leave.

Hooligan:
Please can you quote me saying you weren't doing a decent job as a moderator?
Also I said in this very thread I have nothing against how moderation has been handled here. Locking up the thread was an ok thing to do.
The ONLY thing bothering me is your attitude about this, as I explained before.

MikeyMike:
Or you could just leave

Hooligan:
That I will do when I see fit.

<-------------->

There some blah blah in the between.. anyone interested can read the thread to understand better. The point is, if a moderator spills out such words it automaticly reflects the attitude of the site, like it or not.
No need to tell examples how _ALL_ moderators at AW.net have been accused of doing this and while its only a couple actually doing the harsh moderating.

I like Amiga.org moderating how it was. I don't want such attitude you presented. And by looking how many comments this thread had, I don't think I am alone. Actually, even by taking a look only at that thread you can see I'm not alone.
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