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[Events] Alchimie IV OS4 PresentationANN.lu
Posted on 28-Sep-2004 00:37 GMT by MasterOfReality161 comments
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Slides used as part of the OS4 presentation in France at the weekend have now been made available online.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 51 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by itix on 28-Sep-2004 08:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 50 (Anonymous):
@anonNobody. Maybe the meteorite storm destroys both Hyperion and The MorphOS Team headquarters we never ever see updates.@FriedenOK. That explains it then.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 52 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Rik Sweeney on 28-Sep-2004 08:50 GMT
The audio.device -> AHI sounds nice, but can someone give me an example of where it'll be useful (most games won't run under anything but emulation so they don't count)?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 53 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 08:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 34 (Thomas Frieden):
And who copied the AmigaOS API first ? Hyperion OS or MorphOS in 99 ?
:-P
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 54 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re on 28-Sep-2004 09:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 53 (Anonymous):
AROS?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 55 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 09:07 GMT
In reply to Comment 52 (Rik Sweeney):
There is those games which do use RTG but noit AHI. Eg. Napalm is one of those.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 56 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 09:09 GMT
In reply to Comment 53 (Anonymous):
Again, OS4 is AmigaOS so it does not copy AmigaOS API. How hard is it to understand ? Most of the people here understands it, why you don't ?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 57 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by priest on 28-Sep-2004 09:10 GMT
In reply to Comment 53 (Anonymous):
What part of "AmigaOS4 is AmigaOS" you do not understand?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 58 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Christoph Gutjahr on 28-Sep-2004 10:00 GMT
In reply to Comment 52 (Rik Sweeney):
>> The audio.device -> AHI sounds nice, but can someone give me an example of
>> where it'll be useful (most games won't run under anything but emulation so
>> they don't count)?

Games and applications that support RTG but not AHI, e.g. Napalm, Payback, Trapped, Samplitude Opus...
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 59 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Don Cox on 28-Sep-2004 10:42 GMT
In reply to Comment 52 (Rik Sweeney):
"The audio.device -> AHI sounds nice, but can someone give me an example of where it'll be useful"

Samplitude, OctaMED SS, probably some other audio and music programs.

It seems to be just a port of Nulle Puh. I hope eventually it will be fully integrated so that it does not have to be run as a program. But this is still useful.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 60 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 11:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 56 (Anonymous):
AmigaOS PowerPC IS MorphOS, Why don't people understand :-)
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 61 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 11:16 GMT
Where is the corrupted data feature on this presentation ? :-)

Remenber hardware cache cohenrency is possible on others hardware than the ArticiaS ...
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 62 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Hans-Joerg Frieden on 28-Sep-2004 11:19 GMT
In reply to Comment 53 (Anonymous):
> And who copied the AmigaOS API first ? Hyperion OS or MorphOS in 99 ?

There is no "Hyperion OS". We do AmigaOS, whether you like it or not, Mr. Anonymous.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 63 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 11:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 61 (Anonymous):
If some fanatics think like that. it does not mean it would be the truth.

It has already been shown, that DMA works just fine in OS4.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 64 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 11:26 GMT
In reply to Comment 60 (Anonymous):
Yeah right, and WindowsXP is x86 MacOS.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 65 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by ece on 28-Sep-2004 11:43 GMT
As a matter of fact:

Håkan Lans SWE inventor af the first computersystem with colourgraphics U.S. Patent 4,303,986... Abused by all big capital companys, meaning pirated... incl. Hitachi among others

Douglas Engelbart USA inventor of the computermouse. no patent I belive..

Tell me who copies who, a**holes???
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 66 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by BCP on 28-Sep-2004 11:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 60 (Anonymous):
Amiga OS4.0 is Amiga OS because Hyperion has a LICENCE from Amiga Inc./Kmos, the
legal owners of Amiga OS, to develope OS4 based upon AOS 3.1 sources. The
developers of MorphOS have no such licence.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 67 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 12:03 GMT
In reply to Comment 66 (BCP):
None of which is relevant anyway.

People, on all sides, grow up, learn to discriminate what's good from what's bad on the basis of less superficial facets than the "right to the name".
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 68 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 12:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 45 (Anonymous):
AmigaOS 1.0 = AmigaOS, AmigaOS2.0 = AmigaOS, AmigaOS3.0 = AmigaOS

Guess what? AmigaOS4.0 is not a copy of AmigaOS nor any of it's features or functionalities, it IS AmigaOS. End of story.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 69 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 12:20 GMT
In reply to Comment 68 (Sammy Nordström):
Sigh, we were all waiting for your noteworthy contribution to the thread, Sammy. In fact, no one has stated before you what you just stated.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 70 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 12:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 66 (BCP):
It's not just about lisence. OS4 is based on AmigaOS code which is ported to PPC and imroved much.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 71 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re on 28-Sep-2004 12:22 GMT
In reply to Comment 67 (Fabio Alemagna):
Simple question to ya, "Is AmigaOS4 AmigaOS?" :)

For me, it is, it has the name and it has the aproval of the company owning the previous versions.

I don't see on what other grounds you can discuss this, i really don't.

Besides, this kind of discussion usually tends to draw in the trolls (afew are already here) so lets not get into this to deep
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 72 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 12:33 GMT
In reply to Comment 69 (Fabio Alemagna):
>In fact, no one has stated before you what you just stated.

Yes, you just didn't get the point. For example, in comment #67 you dismissed a post saying exactly the same thing as me as irrelevant.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 73 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 12:35 GMT
In reply to Comment 71 (Amon_Re):
> Simple question to ya, "Is AmigaOS4 AmigaOS?" :)

Didn't I just say the answer to this question is irrelevant?

> For me, it is, it has the name and it has the aproval of the company owning
> the previous versions.

Which, again, is irrelevant to someone who is not superficial.

> I don't see on what other grounds you can discuss this, i really don't.

And I don't see on what grounds you think I've discussed that.

> Besides, this kind of discussion usually tends to draw in the trolls (afew are
> already here) so lets not get into this to deep

Which is exactly what I said: give it a rest, it's irrelevant anyway, besides being completely OT and already talked about tens of times.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 74 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 12:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 72 (Sammy Nordström):
> >In fact, no one has stated before you what you just stated.
>
> Yes, you just didn't get the point.

I think you didn't get the point. That was sarcasm, Sammy. Do I need to make a drawing to make you understand what I said?

> For example, in comment #67 you dismissed a post saying exactly the same thing
> as me as irrelevant.

Exactly! Now you get my point, Sammy?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 75 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 12:40 GMT
In reply to Comment 66 (BCP):
And MorphOS should have been named AmigaOS 4 and Hyperion port
softwore for it...

I don't care of the name; only of technologies.
You care about the name...
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 76 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 12:46 GMT
In reply to Comment 73 (Fabio Alemagna):
It became relevant when certain individuals amazingly enough accused Hyperion of "copying" features from previous versions of the product line that they are developing the official successor to. The response to those claims in this thread are perfectly natural, IMO.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 77 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 12:47 GMT
In reply to Comment 75 (Anonymous):
>And MorphOS should have been named AmigaOS 4

Yes, but they blew their chance, live with it.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 78 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re on 28-Sep-2004 12:48 GMT
In reply to Comment 73 (Fabio Alemagna):
I agree that the qustion *IS* irelevant, i just didn't interpret your statement as such, my bad.

As for wether or not my statement was superficial... i disagree, but hey, that too is irelevant.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 79 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 12:51 GMT
In reply to Comment 74 (Fabio Alemagna):
Sarcasm doesn't work too well in online forums, now does it? Try atleast using a smiley or something next time...
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 80 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by hooligan/dcs on 28-Sep-2004 12:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 74 (Fabio Alemagna):
>Do I need to make a drawing to make you understand what I said?


I'd like to offer you a challenge, can you try drawing it, please? :)
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 81 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by thefab on 28-Sep-2004 13:11 GMT
what is this bullshit about audio.device emulation??

i though hyperion did not care about backward compatibility?

they said so about warpos/powerup compatibility, and now they throw out of the magic hat, the audio.emulation which bring less apps than old ppc libraries emulation.

...
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 82 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 13:13 GMT
In reply to Comment 80 (hooligan/dcs):
You bastard :-)
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 83 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 13:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 78 (Amon_Re):
> As for wether or not my statement was superficial... i disagree, but hey, that
> too is irelevant.

The statement per-se is not superficial, it's just a fact that AmigaOSX.Y is AmigaOS. Heck, it's a tautology.

What's superficial is the behaviour of those who care about that tautology, and use it to discriminate the goods from the bads.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 84 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 13:38 GMT
In reply to Comment 83 (Fabio Alemagna):
>The statement per-se is not superficial, it's just a fact that AmigaOSX.Y is
>AmigaOS. Heck, it's a tautology.

Look, Fabio just learned a new word. :-P

Anyway, if it was so obvious that AmigaOSX.Y is AmigaOS, then why do people keep claiming otherwise? I mean, it's not like my statement came out of the blue, it was a reply to someone who obviously hadn't already realized what you claim is such an obvious fact. Perhaps it is obvious to you, and me too of course, but what problem is it for you when I tell it to someone that obviously isn't as enlightened as you and me?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 85 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 13:49 GMT
In reply to Comment 83 (Fabio Alemagna):
>What's superficial is the behaviour of those who care about that tautology,
>and use it to discriminate the goods from the bads.

It isn't about discriminating anything, it's about making a distinction of what is what. For some reason, some people like to alianate the AmigaOS4 from the AmigaOS product line and some even claim that MorphOS would be AmigaOS (see comment #60). To say that such statements are false is NOT "discriminating the goods from the bads". Dismissing people like me as only interested in the official product line for the sake of following "the name" is discrimination if you ask me.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 86 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Fabio Alemagna on 28-Sep-2004 14:06 GMT
In reply to Comment 84 (Sammy Nordström):
> Look, Fabio just learned a new word. :-P

Ahah. Ohoh.

On the other hand, it looks like you still need to learn the various meanings of "discriminating": I've not used it negatively in this context, it was used as to mean "telling the goods and the ones apart".

Hope that clears up a few things for you.

As for some people claiming AmigaOS4 is not AmigaOS: they're just here to provoke the kind of reactions you show. If you were smart enough you'd get their point without need to reiterate for the n-th time the same rants. Jesus, you yourself admitted that one of your former posts was completely redundant, as someone else had already made those points.

Kind of when the Frieden bro's post replies to the same comment saying exactly the same things. Irritating, to say the least.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 87 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Hans-Joerg Frieden on 28-Sep-2004 14:12 GMT
In reply to Comment 67 (Fabio Alemagna):
> People, on all sides, grow up, learn to discriminate what's good from what's
> bad on the basis of less superficial facets than the "right to the name"

I think the original statement was not what is good or bad, but that "HyperionOS copied from MorphOS". To which I stated that there is no "HyperionOS" and that we do AmigaOS. No quality statement was included nor intended.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 88 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Hans-Joerg Frieden on 28-Sep-2004 14:14 GMT
In reply to Comment 75 (Anonymous):
> And MorphOS should have been named AmigaOS 4 and Hyperion port
> softwore for it...

Oh, now *that* old story. LOL!

Hyperion "should" port softwore for it? I think we're free to decide where our software works on.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 89 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Hans-Joerg Frieden on 28-Sep-2004 14:16 GMT
In reply to Comment 81 (thefab):
> they said so about warpos/powerup compatibility, and now they throw out of the
> magic hat, the audio.emulation which bring less apps than old ppc libraries
> emulation.

"they" also killed Kenny.

As mentioned previously, WarpOS compatibility is not of prime concern, but "don't care" is a different thing. Besides, I don't see what audio.device/Paula has to do with WarpOS... But you probably already knew that as well.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 90 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 14:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 86 (Fabio Alemagna):
>it was used as to mean "telling the goods and the ones apart".

This might be nitpicking but no, it was used to mean "telling the goods from the bads". The difference is quite significant, if you ask me.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 91 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 14:27 GMT
In reply to Comment 86 (Fabio Alemagna):
>As for some people claiming AmigaOS4 is not AmigaOS: they're just here to
>provoke the kind of reactions you show.

Maybe, maybe not. If you would ask me what my name is, I would definitly know that you're just acting stupid. However, if someone I don't know would ask me what my name is, I simply answer regardless of how many times I've had to answer that question before. Do you see what I'm trying to say here?
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 92 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Amon_Re on 28-Sep-2004 14:41 GMT
In reply to Comment 83 (Fabio Alemagna):
There is no good/bad in these things, it's silly beyond words :P
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 93 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 14:52 GMT
In reply to Comment 75 (Anonymous):
You care about technology ? Are you sure ? Maybe you don't know what you are talking about.

MorphOS is not based on AmigaOS technology at all, it just implements AmigaOS API. It's not AmigaOS, it's a clone. AmigaOS 4 is based on AmigaOS technology, it does not just implement API and it is AmigaOS no matter if you like it or not.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 94 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 15:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 85 (Sammy Nordström):
Amazing.

> It isn't about discriminating anything,
> it's about making a distinction of what is what.

== discriminating.

(Förihelvete samface! Detta är inte DN:s kultursida. Bara för att ordet "diskriminera" används fullkomligt felaktigt och med negativa undertoner i svensk politik så betyder det inte att den engelsktalande världen måste anpassa sig till dina villfarelser.)
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 95 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 15:44 GMT
In reply to Comment 94 (Anonymous):
Excuse my swedish but "för i helvete", what does "discriminate the goods from the bads" mean to you? How about if you would point your browser to:

http://lexikon.nada.kth.se/cgi-bin/sve-eng

Type in the word "diskriminering" and hit "Översätt!". I know, discrimination is a word that can be interpreted in different ways, but please keep in mind that it was put in the context "discriminate the goods from the bads". Now crawl back under the rock you came from, anonymous coward.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 96 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by brotheris on 28-Sep-2004 16:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 88 (Hans-Joerg Frieden):
I think we're free to decide where our software works on

So your games work on tyour system now ? ;-]
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 97 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by brotheris on 28-Sep-2004 16:18 GMT
In reply to Comment 93 (Anonymous):
MorphOS is not based on AmigaOS technology at all, it just implements AmigaOS API

Yes, beneath it has technology for compatibility AND the future today.
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 98 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Sammy Nordström on 28-Sep-2004 16:21 GMT
In reply to Comment 97 (brotheris):
>Yes, beneath it has technology for compatibility AND the future today.

That depends on what future you are refering to. When it comes to AmigaOS compatibility, only the real AmigaOS is future compatible. :-P
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 99 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by brotheris on 28-Sep-2004 16:28 GMT
In reply to Comment 98 (Sammy Nordström):
For example - current apps AND memory protection (yes, I know that it won't be for current apps). Anyway, box design was laughed at by your favorite hyperion. Will you laugh when they'll implement box design in future too (by reimplementing current system again). It would be quite interesting to hear what Kjetil will say then ;-D
Alchimie IV OS4 Presentation : Comment 100 of 161ANN.lu
Posted by Anonymous on 28-Sep-2004 16:32 GMT
In reply to Comment 98 (Sammy Nordström):
But then again - only the real MorphOS will be MorphOS compatible in the future! :-P
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